Caribbean Biotope Seagrass Tank

[Michael Hoaster]

That's the idea, Chasmodes, to get Norbert in there with Sheldon, and seeing him eat frozen. It's a catch-22 situation though. I want to keep him healthy and well fed, so today I fed them some of the remaining feeders I have. Norbert demonstrated his ability to chow down on them to Sheldon…

[Michael Hoaster]

McPuff, I have found that a regular, one hour drip acclimation works fine with mollies. I'd go a little longer for a full strength sea water tank.

Right now I don't have enough males. I think a ratio of 1 male for every 2-3 females would be good. So I have some more molly shopping to do. I was pleasantly surprised they school so well in the big display, where they could easily spread out.

So I may have found the schooling fish I've been looking for!

[Michael Hoaster]

I feel a pain, in ma balls. Why is that Sam?

I really do want to post a video. First I have to straighten up the jungle a bit. It's a mess! Don't hold your breath…

I got silver mollies this time. I thought they'd look more natural, and they do. Right now I'm trying to figure out how many I need.

[Michael Hoaster]

Scored four new males for the molly school. Now I need four more females to get to two to one. That will make it 15 mollies in the display. That's a pretty big school! Now I just need them to get busy and make babies.

I was feeding them spirulina flakes today and Sheldon decided he wanted some too. He liked it! Norbert was incredulous. I still haven't gotten him onto frozen food.

[McPuff]

Originally Posted by Michael Hoaster

McPuff, I have found that a regular, one hour drip acclimation works fine with mollies. I'd go a little longer for a full strength sea water tank.

Right now I don't have enough males. I think a ratio of 1 male for every 2-3 females would be good. So I have some more molly shopping to do. I was pleasantly surprised they school so well in the big display, where they could easily spread out.

So I may have found the schooling fish I've been looking for!

Excellent, that is actually quite a fast acclimation. I'd probably try for about 3-4 hours. And I agree that silver mollies will probably be the best option as they provide some "flash" and would be a nice contract to the rest of my tank (in particular) as nothing else is silver/white like that. Time for me to place an order at the LFS! The new rocks have plenty of algae for them to munch on! :0)

[Michael Hoaster]

The first time I acclimated mollies to saltwater, I did it for five hours. I got black ones. They didn't school as well, they didn't look that natural in my tank, and they were actually hard to see/find. The silvers look a little like a school of mullet, boldly mixing it up with the lookdowns at the surface. The males, with their sail fins, are quite pretty.

It took awhile to get them eating algae. These fish are farm raised and very removed from their natural environment. They seemed to be waiting to be fed, but I didn't. Eventually, they rediscovered their ability to forage for algae, even eating a little cyano. As my 'plague of snails' took hold, they disappeared, presumably from starvation. I'm feeding these new mollies, as I still have hundreds of snails and not much micro algae for them. Plus I'm trying to fatten them up quickly, so they'll make babies.

I'd be very interested to hear how they do with your new rocks.

[Michael Hoaster]

Norbert, the lookdown, took a turn for the worse overnight. He refused food this morning and died this afternoon. Rest in peace.

[zachxlutz]

Originally Posted by Michael Hoaster

Norbert, the lookdown, took a turn for the worse overnight. He refused food this morning and died this afternoon. Rest in peace.

Oh no. Sad day. Sorry for your loss. He gave it a valiant effort I'll say.

[Michael Hoaster]

Thank you zachxlutz. It happens. It's tough, after all that effort, but sometimes they die.

On the bright side, Sheldon is super strong and fit, so that's good. I think he'll do fine as a single fish. I can add another later, or not, we'll see.

I did a big export today, I mean a simulated herbivore grazing event. I was overdue. I may do some more tomorrow.

[sam.basye]

Are lookdowns generally picky eaters and tough to get eating? Wondering if you just got lucky that you have one that eats when most can't get any to eat.

I hate losing a fish or coral, it's like lighting your money on fire. Lol That and I'm sure you got pretty attached to it since it needed constant help.

Strange how quick it can happen...

Hopefully Sheldon will continue to eat!

[Michael Hoaster]

Nothing I read spoke of lookdowns being picky eaters. Like many Atlantic/Caribbean species, they are considered bulletproof. My LFS owner told me I might need to employ feeders to get them to transition to frozen mysis. Sheldon easily transitioned. I actually think I got UNlucky to get a fish that probably suffered too much stress, in the chain of custody. It really seemed like he had some brain damage. He was not near as sharp as Sheldon and appeared blind at times. Yes, it was a big blow to lose him after so much special care. I'd like to think he lived longer and better than he would have otherwise, under my care, buy who knows.

It was strange how quickly he went. From refusing feeders in the morning, to losing equilibrium in the afternoon, and then dying so quickly. When he didn't eat, I knew something was up.

After I've had more time to think about it, I'd like to discuss what went wrong and the mistakes I made with this fish.

Fortunately, Sheldon is very sharp, chasing down and tasting almost every speck in the water. He's even joining in the feeding frenzy, when I feed flake foods! He's a bit like Zippy 2.0, without the taste for sea weeds…

[Chasmodes]

Sorry to hear about Norbert. I think you did about all you could do. It does seem that something was wrong from the beginning. Perhaps he had some sort of internal disease or damage of some sort all along.

[sam.basye]

Do you know how long the LFS has them prior to you buying them?

[Michael Hoaster]

Thanks, Chasmodes. I agree, he was in pretty rough shape when I got him.

Sam, the LFS had just gotten them in that day, so it wasn't their fault. I think the problem was that it's an Atlantic/Caribbean fish, that came to my LFS through an LA importer, so he took a long, circuitous route to get here. That increased the time without food and who knows how many stops along the way.

So the fault is all mine. I should have observed the fish more carefully from the start.

[sam.basye]

Ah, you win some you lose some, right?



But I wholely agree with this statement

Originally Posted by Michael Hoaster

So the fault is all mine.

[Michael Hoaster]

[Darth_Tater]

I still think those Grammas are just awesome!

[Chasmodes]

You can look it another way though, that Norbert's death was imminent, and you were his only chance for survival from the time that you bought him until his death. During that time, I can't see that you did anything wrong. Do you think he'd have died while still in quarantine? Maybe, maybe not.

Where it's your fault for sure is that you lost money!

[sam.basye]

Originally Posted by Chasmodes

You can look it another way though, that Norbert's death was imminent, and you were his only chance for survival from the time that you bought him until his death. During that time, I can't see that you did anything wrong. Do you think he'd have died while still in quarantine? Maybe, maybe not.

Where it's your fault for sure is that you lost money!

+1

That last statement would be one my wife would say. Lol

[Michael Hoaster]

Yeah, Darth Tater, I'm still loving' the grammas too! I'm in awe of the stable harem social structure. Who would have thought I could get away with putting seven of them in one aquarium! None have died, they're all thriving, and spawning seems to be happening continuously. I think the fake wall, with its gramma caves is a huge factor. Whatever it is, I've never appreciated these fish as much as I do now. They're my "poor man's anthias school", with MUCH sturdier fish!

[Michael Hoaster]

Yes, Chasmodes, I think Norbert's death was imminent. I think I got him out of QT at the right time, as he was getting restless in the small confines and was scratching up his face. He swam and ate with vigor in the display until Saturday. Whatever got him just accelerated towards the end.

[Michael Hoaster]

So, the tank as a whole, is changing. It's nice to return my focus to the overall ecosystem. Having the new additions of Sheldon and a pretty large school of mollies has added a lot of visual energy to the tank, as well as a new community structure. It will be very interesting to see what happens when the mollies start cranking out the babies. I go back and forth, wondering if I've added too many or not enough. Will their population explode? Will they reach a balance, and what does that look like?

What I'm hoping for is a steady influx of fry that Sheldon and the grammas and bennies can all hunt and eat. In theory, I think it would be possible to get a big enough school of mollies to feed everyone. Then I would only need to feed the mollies! I don't expect to be able to do that with this particular setup, but it's one of those ideals I like to think about.

The grammas aren't particularly enamored with the mollies, as they have a similar body shape. Whenever they swim down to the lower areas of the tank, the grammas 'encourage' them to go back up. It's pretty interesting, visually to see them mingle. The vivid magenta and yellow versus the blinding white looks cool!

So far the endless pool theory is working out swimmingly for Sheldon. It's the idea that, with a good gyre flow, lookdowns can be kept in tanks smaller than was previously thought possible. I suppose at some point, he'll outgrow it, but I think it's going to work well for a good chunk of time.

It's fun to think about how this lookdown/molly experiment will unfold. I think it will go a lot like the blue tang/macro algae experiment. At first, the macros outpaced Zippy's appetite, but as he grew, they could't quite keep up. Eventually, he wiped them out. I think at some point, Sheldon will grow big enough to eat even the parent mollies and then it will be over! In the meantime, it should be fascinating to watch. Even watching Norbert hunting the fry in the QT was a blast.

One more thing to mention: I removed the large "corpse bride" grasilaria. It was just getting too big, crowding out some others. Of course I left a little behind, so I expect it will come back.

[McPuff]

Those mollies do look great... I was wondering about that so I'm glad you posted a pic of them (a few actually). I just placed an order for 6-8 silver mollies at my LFS yesterday. Looking forward to getting them!

P.S. I posted a thread on my 300 in the Large Tanks forum if you want to check it out. :0)

[Michael Hoaster]

Cool! I'll check it out.

[zachxlutz]

Michael - I just came across this video while researching flow patterns for the two new Gyre XF230's that I've got coming in and noticed they have several lookdowns in the display tank they're showing the gyres off. Thought you'd get a kick out of it!

https://youtu.be/y0RQQn_rpzc?t=233