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Unread 04/23/2019, 08:40 PM   #26
swhobbie1
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I have learned a lot over the years with this hobby but recently learned that like designing technology solutions it is a very good idea to build redundancies in our reefs. I did a WC. Before going to bed I was thinking how beautiful the tank looked that night. Next morning I get up, then realize one by one every fish in my tank is dead. I had them for 3 to 15 years , all dead. I’m not sure what caused it - either a contaminant in the boxed ocean water I used or perhaps the PH was very high leading to ammonia or something. I realized my Apex looked like it was working but was not doing any alerts- no audible, no email, no txt so no warning of a problem. I promptly bought a seneye monitor which duplicates some of what my apex does but also alerts for ammonia. Had tanks for decades and never had this problem. Never want to wake up to that sight again. I put a $5k generator on my house for that 15 year old clownfish I started back into the hobby with. Never like to see a fish die but some are more special than others.


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Unread 04/24/2019, 12:19 AM   #27
laverda
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Originally Posted by AlexR View Post
This has nothing to do with quarantining or not. Although it can for other situations.
I rarely add new fish. Very rarely.

I just looked up the lifespan of the bengai cardinal. Mine was about 5 years in my tank and who knows how old when I got him.
Their lifespan in the wild is about 2 years. In captivity they can live longer but up to around 4 years. So I feel good about giving this fish a nice long life.
I don't know where you are getting your information but I have a Bengai Cardinal that is 11 years old and still very healthy. I have 4 fish 22-27 years old currently. When fish die of old age you can see it coming they start looking like an old fish. They slow down, lose weight, their colors fade and their fins become tattered. It does not happen overnight, if you are paying attenion to their condition. I have a wrasse that is going through it now. It looks like an old fish! It still eats and I make sure it gets extra food, but I know it will not be around in a month or two and I will be sad.


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Unread 04/24/2019, 05:52 AM   #28
AlexR
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Originally Posted by laverda View Post
I don't know where you are getting your information but I have a Bengai Cardinal that is 11 years old and still very healthy. I have 4 fish 22-27 years old currently. When fish die of old age you can see it coming they start looking like an old fish. They slow down, lose weight, their colors fade and their fins become tattered. It does not happen overnight, if you are paying attenion to their condition. I have a wrasse that is going through it now. It looks like an old fish! It still eats and I make sure it gets extra food, but I know it will not be around in a month or two and I will be sad.


I use google


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Unread 04/24/2019, 07:29 AM   #29
MondoBongo
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Originally Posted by AlexR View Post
I use google
i would be skeptical of that information.

honestly, i think many of the estimates we see for fish longevity are based on poor husbandry, or not knowing how old the fish you got was.

i know some clownfish and tangs old enough to graduate from college, and even allegedly fragile fish like Orange Spotted Filefish (Oxymonacanthus longirostris) should live at least 4 or 5 years in captivity.


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Unread 04/24/2019, 08:29 AM   #30
AlexR
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Unlike many other species of marine fish, the Banggai cardinalfish lacks a planktonic stage in its life history. The species has a short lifespan, reaching around 4 years in optimal conditions in captivity, and perhaps 1 to 2 years in the wild.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bang...alfish#Ecology


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Unread 04/24/2019, 08:36 AM   #31
MondoBongo
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Originally Posted by AlexR View Post
Unlike many other species of marine fish, the Banggai cardinalfish lacks a planktonic stage in its life history. The species has a short lifespan, reaching around 4 years in optimal conditions in captivity, and perhaps 1 to 2 years in the wild.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bang...alfish#Ecology
yeah, i read the link. the information is not exactly hard to find.

but i'm still highly skeptical of it. in fact, i've never seen any information on how those longevity statistics were collected. were they actual studies? if so, what were their controls? how did they identify and track individuals? how did they account for their variables?

i tend to think most of those estimates are about 15 - 20% lower than they should be.

-edit- i tried to hit their citation link, but it 404s.


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Unread 04/24/2019, 08:40 AM   #32
AlexR
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Originally Posted by MondoBongo View Post
yeah, i read the link. the information is not exactly hard to find.

but i'm still highly skeptical of it. in fact, i've never seen any information on how those longevity statistics were collected. were they actual studies? if so, what were their controls? how did they identify and track individuals? how did they account for their variables?

i tend to think most of those estimates are about 15 - 20% lower than they should be.

-edit- i tried to hit their citation link, but it 404s.


While I tend to agree with you.
This makes me feel better about the fish’s death so I’ll go with it.

My live stock was added a couple months ago.
The cardinal was acting sluggish for a little while, about a week or so.
At times is looked weak. But was still eating good.
Then i found it jammed inside a crevice like it got stuck there, where it was dead.


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Unread 04/24/2019, 09:59 AM   #33
d0ughb0y
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Last time I had fish die, my kids were still small, and they will sing the wizard of oz munchkin coroner song before we flush the fish down the toilet.


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Unread 04/25/2019, 11:15 AM   #34
laverda
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Originally Posted by AlexR View Post
Unlike many other species of marine fish, the Banggai cardinalfish lacks a planktonic stage in its life history. The species has a short lifespan, reaching around 4 years in optimal conditions in captivity, and perhaps 1 to 2 years in the wild.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bang...alfish#Ecology
Clearly that info is wrong as both mine are much older with my female being 11 years in my care and still looking good. She eas fully grown when I got her so probably 12 years old. My best guess is my name is at least 7 years old. I know other people yhat have had them 6+7 years as well.


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Unread 04/26/2019, 11:44 PM   #35
reret10
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I once won a goldfish at the school carnival in 1st grade. Being a kid, I kept him in a big bowl with a bunch of plants. I had that fish for 13 years and it died 2 days after I graduated high school. I'm not too emotional of a person but I think I cried more that day than any other time in my life. Something about marking the end of my childhood and such.

I also have a Bangaii Cardinal that's at least 6 years old so they have to live a bit longer than that!


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Unread 04/30/2019, 07:11 PM   #36
VIVVIV
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This might be a bit off topic, but I was wondering if anyone found it very odd and sad at the same time that we engage in a conversation about Fish Grieving, but no one talks about the children all over the world dying because they don't have food, medicine, shelter. Etc. Maybe my visits to Ukrainian Orphananges, while being valiantly run for almost nothing have changed my view.

But let's get back to earth. Do you propose to shed a tear for a fish you bought causing it to be recklessly plucked from the ocean to be sold you and others. You SHOULD have cried the day you bought it, because that is effectively when you sentanced it to death.

But I am still in the hobby in a new way.
1-Man made rock or substitute (anything except actual harvested live rock)
2-Captive bread fish only.
3-Only commercially grown corals and frags. Frag and share as many as you can to keep the DNA cooking.

I feel much better doing it this way.


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Unread 04/30/2019, 07:15 PM   #37
AlexR
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A bit off topic? You think?!?

I suggest going on a political forum and let your liberalism fly. I’m not here for that.

When a pet is in my possession I am responsible for it. I am not responsible for the worlds problems or yours.


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Unread 04/30/2019, 07:24 PM   #38
AlexR
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Some people (like me) enjoy this hobby to get their minds off of other things. That’s what hobbies tend to be for for some people.
Usually responsible adults who already have a ton on their plate to deal with.

Throwing guilt trips around saying a pet your responsible for should not be thought about because children are dying and people are starving is ridiculous imo.

Just saying. Your post is totally uncalled for and is just plain wrong in a hobbyist forum for salt water aquarium hobbyists.


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Unread 05/08/2019, 02:10 PM   #39
hkgar
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Originally Posted by alexr View Post
some people (like me) enjoy this hobby to get their minds off of other things. That’s what hobbies tend to be for for some people.
Usually responsible adults who already have a ton on their plate to deal with.

Throwing guilt trips around saying a pet your responsible for should not be thought about because children are dying and people are starving is ridiculous imo.

Just saying. Your post is totally uncalled for and is just plain wrong in a hobbyist forum for salt water aquarium hobbyists.
+1


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Current Tank Info: A 2 Barred Rabbitfish, Red Head Salon, Yellow/Purple, McMaster Fairy, Possum, 2 Leopard Wrasses, Kole, & Atlantic Blue Tangs, 2 Percula Clown, 3 PJ and 1 Banggai Cardinalfish , Swallowtail, Bellus and Coral Beauty Angels
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Unread 05/09/2019, 01:27 PM   #40
j.falk
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I tend to not get attached to the fish I keep. I also no longer name them (which my wife thinks is weird since they are our pets).

I think it's because I worked at a local fish store for 14 years of my life and I saw lots of fish die during my time there. Cleaning out the dead fish from the tanks every morning before the store opened was just another part of the job so I guess it sort of numbed me to fish deaths as it was a daily occurrence.



Last edited by j.falk; 05/09/2019 at 01:34 PM.
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Unread 05/09/2019, 01:45 PM   #41
AlexR
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I tend to not get attached to the fish I keep. I also no longer name them (which my wife thinks is weird since they are our pets).

I think it's because I worked at a local fish store for 14 years of my life and I saw lots of fish die during my time there. Cleaning out the dead fish from the tanks every morning before the store opened was just another part of the job so I guess it sort of numbed me to fish deaths as it was a daily occurrence.


I can understand this.
I always figure each fish you own and if it’s alive for long enough you get used to it individual characteristics.
Each fish species is similar in a way but when it’s yours in your own environment they tend to become more familiar and thus the attachment happens.
That’s just me tho.


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Unread 05/09/2019, 03:44 PM   #42
Fish559
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I try to learn from it if it's something I did wrong. I tell myself that these are delicate creates that I knowingly took from their natural habitat, and that I do the best I can to keep them healthy.

And if I'm being honest, I immediately think about a fish to replace it. Sorry, but I do.


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Unread 05/09/2019, 03:45 PM   #43
Fish559
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Originally Posted by VIVVIV View Post
This might be a bit off topic, but I was wondering if anyone found it very odd and sad at the same time that we engage in a conversation about Fish Grieving, but no one talks about the children all over the world dying because they don't have food, medicine, shelter. Etc.
What the heck?


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Unread 05/09/2019, 03:47 PM   #44
AlexR
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I try to learn from it if it's something I did wrong. I tell myself that these are delicate creates that I knowingly took from their natural habitat, and that I do the best I can to keep them healthy.

And if I'm being honest, I immediately think about a fish to replace it. Sorry, but I do.


It takes me a while. It’s rare I add fish.
I added fish a couple months ago and before that it was about 5 years ago.
From the new fish I added I had one death.
I do plan on adding a few more eventually. Maybe another couple months from now.


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Unread 05/09/2019, 03:50 PM   #45
AlexR
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What the heck?


The person who posted that must have some serious issues...
You can post that in just about any forum for any topic and it’s a valid argument — but has absolutely nothing to do with the topic at hand.
Just strange to bring up such things here.


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Unread 05/11/2019, 06:01 AM   #46
KafudaFish
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Floater = red solo cup
Bobber = net
Wedge = chopsticks


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Unread 05/11/2019, 10:12 AM   #47
AlexR
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Floater = red solo cup
Bobber = net
Wedge = chopsticks


For me it’s rare. I am not that accustomed to a fish death in my tank.


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Unread 05/12/2019, 10:30 PM   #48
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I had a aquarium maintenance business for the past 25 plus years. I was always amazed how my customers took it for granted their fish would never die.

Salt water fish would live from the time my customer's children were born until they went into high school, some freshwater fish lived even longer (certain cichlids, & clown loaches are nearly immortal). And when the damn things would finally kick the bucket they would complain.

I had a customer with a beautiful planted barb tank (freshwater) complain one of his many tiger barbs died, to which I replied, "Thank God! You've had those things nearly six years! They have a life span of two years. It was creeping me out!"

Some other customers had fish die, and I told them, "Sorry your fish finally died, but it was about time - I've never had a cat or dog live for 20 years."


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Unread 05/14/2019, 09:42 PM   #49
cody6766
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I see my reef fish as a hybrid between a decoration and a pet. They're living critters which I assume enter my tank as healthy animals (probably not always true, but it'll make sense in a second). I don't really fell sad if a fish dies, but do feel like I failed at my responsibilities. If I take on a life (fish, coral, snail or plant), I feel that I should give it my best to keep it alive. That means conditions, equipment, water quality, etc. I owe it to the life in my glass box to do my best to make it thrive.
A the end of the day, I look at a dead fish/coral/etc and ask, "what could I have done?" If the answer is nothing, I send it down the toilet and don't bat an eye. If I somehow neglected its care, I take that as a lesson learned, feel a little bad for killing something in my care and do better next time. "Better" may mean not buying it again or changing my reef. Life is important and I feel a little worse losing a long-term fish than a week old fish, but no fish has ever seemed like a "real" pet like my parrots or a dog.


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Unread 05/15/2019, 12:39 AM   #50
gargoylenest
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when one of my fishes dies, i see it as a failure on my part to care for an animal that was living happily in the sea before it was kidnapped and put in cage for my pleasure. I keep my wall of shame in my aquarium room with picture of every fishes I failed. Motivate me to do better.


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