I trying the Vodka to reduce nitrates and phosphates

reefloverd1 · 03/20/2009, 09:14 PM

Ok so I thought I would jump on the bandwagon and try this method. I have a fairly new system but can't get my nitrates and phospates down. I thought about buying the reacters, but ran across this method and decided to try it before forking out alot of money. I will document the entire process here.

I use DI water and Instant Ocean salt.

parameters before vodka:
Ca-450
Alk-2.7 milli-equivelents
Salinity-1.025
pH-8.3
Phosphate-0.5
Ammonia-0
Nitrite-0
Nitrate-50

With my 55g tank I am starting with an initial dose of 0.2 mL(according to RK mag recomendation of 0.1ML/25g) because of all the rock displacing the water

Here is the pic for the Nitrate test

And the test for phosphate

I am using 80 proof vodka and I am not going to do any water changes throughout this experiment.

HighlandReefer · 03/21/2009, 07:27 AM

IME, dosing carbon sources will work to reduce your nitrates and phosphates. One thing to keep in mind is that this reduction will take a fairly extended period of time. Many of the hobbyists who are using vodka will see less than 1.0 ppm (0.3 ppm) drop in nitrate per day. If you are starting at 50 ppm this could mean 150 days to reduce your nitrates at a controlled level. In the first month, you may only see a drop of 10 ppm, which will not show up very well with your test kit. Plus the low end range of your test kit only goes up to 50 ppm, which means you do not know if your level could be 100 ppm. You should make sure that you use the high end range of your nitrate kit to make sure your value is approx. 50 ppm. Personally, I have a very hard time distinguishing the colors at the range you are at and would not have much confidence in your exact level of nitrates. There is quite a span (50 - 100 ppm) in your high range color chart and very little color change.

reefloverd1 · 03/21/2009, 09:45 AM

thanks for your input, i know it will take time, but I want to add another trial to the tally of other experiments and maybe get some benefits out of it as well.

reefloverd1 · 03/21/2009, 09:52 AM

I dosed 0.2mL of vodka last night around 9:30pm. I will do an identical dose tonight around the same time.

Genetics · 03/21/2009, 10:17 AM

reefloverd1, are you suspending water changes or do you not do water changes often?

reefloverd1 · 03/21/2009, 10:32 AM

yes i am suspending them, normally i do a weekly change of 6 gallons

Genetics · 03/21/2009, 10:37 AM

You should think about continuation upfront. It will take you around 6 weeks to notice a difference in nitrates.

reefloverd1 · 03/21/2009, 10:46 AM

I am fine with the continuation.

ccradr · 03/21/2009, 01:54 PM

So you shouldnt do water changes while dosing vodka?

HighlandReefer · 03/21/2009, 05:29 PM

I would continue water changes myself. It will help to reduce your nitrate levels in your water column to some extent as well as remove possible build-up of contaminates. Water changes will also help by removing bacteria which have absorbed nitrates into their system. Good skimming practices will help to export these bacteria as well. Every little bit counts in my book.

reefloverd1 · 03/21/2009, 08:02 PM

You have a good point, I wanted to see how long it would take to get them to zero without a water change, but now considering the inhabitants,(some tube worms and several unidentified hitchhikers) it would probably be better to continue the water changes as well. Thanks highlandreefer for making me rethink my strategy.

I will be dosing another 0.2mL of vodka at 9:30pm But before that I am going to do my routine water change of 6 gallons. so im going to get to it......

HighlandReefer · 03/21/2009, 08:13 PM

Your welcome.

reefloverd1 · 03/22/2009, 04:55 PM

so i did the water change and dosed 0.2 ml of vodka last night at 9:30.

HighlandReefer · 03/23/2009, 06:11 AM

reefloverd1,

I would be interested to hear what the average daily reduction of nitrate is for your tank after you reach your target level. Phosphate daily average would be interesting to know also, but might be harder to determine using the test kits available.

Good luck.

reefloverd1 · 03/23/2009, 02:28 PM

ok, HighlandReefer i will keep more detailed data as to result in more accurate results(hopefully...lol)

So I will be doing another dose of 0.2 ml of vodka tonight at...you guessed it....9:30 pm. This being the third day my dosing will go up through days 4-7(per RK mag). that will bring the new dose to 0.4mL.

I thought I would also post the link to the RK mag article since I am using that as my refrence.

http://reefkeeping.com/issues/2008-08/nftt/index.php

reefloverd1 · 03/23/2009, 03:20 PM

here is the nitrate test after only two days of dosing. I know it probably didn't change much , but I was curious to see what it wa after my water change the other day.[IMG]

[/IMG]

And the phosphate still the same.

I know I should save my tests but I want to use them up so I can buy a different brand.

gaetanocallista · 03/24/2009, 07:16 AM

Do you use bacteria?

reefloverd1 · 03/24/2009, 02:17 PM

gaetanocallista, I have not used those bacteria that you can buy i.e. one and only, cycle.

reefloverd1 · 03/25/2009, 12:39 AM

3-24-09

0.4 mL vodka 9:30pm

scaryperson27 · 03/25/2009, 12:50 AM

I don't like the red sea for nitrates.

scaryperson27 · 03/25/2009, 12:55 AM

Also, what are you running for filtration? An undersized skimmer will definitely seize this project from having any good results.

reefloverd1 · 03/25/2009, 12:58 AM

reefloverd1 · 03/25/2009, 01:00 AM

Yo uso el skimmer Prizm para 100 galones.

scaryperson27 · 03/25/2009, 01:04 AM

The Prizm skimmers are not all they are cracked up to be on the box.

You need something that actually made to handle 100 gallons.

I would suggest maybe
Octopus NW-150, or
Octopus DNW-150

Can you please not talk to me in spanish?

reefloverd1 · 03/25/2009, 01:08 AM

I need the practice sorry, have an exam coming up and noone to speak spanish to.

So what tests do you like?

And Ill be sure to check out those skimmers!

03/20/2009, 09:14 PM	#1
reefloverd1 returns Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: Kansas Posts: 216	I trying the Vodka to reduce nitrates and phosphates Ok so I thought I would jump on the bandwagon and try this method. I have a fairly new system but can't get my nitrates and phospates down. I thought about buying the reacters, but ran across this method and decided to try it before forking out alot of money. I will document the entire process here. I use DI water and Instant Ocean salt. parameters before vodka: Ca-450 Alk-2.7 milli-equivelents Salinity-1.025 pH-8.3 Phosphate-0.5 Ammonia-0 Nitrite-0 Nitrate-50 With my 55g tank I am starting with an initial dose of 0.2 mL(according to RK mag recomendation of 0.1ML/25g) because of all the rock displacing the water Here is the pic for the Nitrate test And the test for phosphate I am using 80 proof vodka and I am not going to do any water changes throughout this experiment. __________________ reefloverd1 Before you criticize someone, you should walk a mile in their shoes. That way when you criticize them, you're a mile away and you have Their shoes. Current Tank Info: 14 gal. Biocube

03/21/2009, 07:27 AM	#2
HighlandReefer Team RC Member Join Date: Aug 2008 Location: Highland, Maryland Entomologist Posts: 14,579	IME, dosing carbon sources will work to reduce your nitrates and phosphates. One thing to keep in mind is that this reduction will take a fairly extended period of time. Many of the hobbyists who are using vodka will see less than 1.0 ppm (0.3 ppm) drop in nitrate per day. If you are starting at 50 ppm this could mean 150 days to reduce your nitrates at a controlled level. In the first month, you may only see a drop of 10 ppm, which will not show up very well with your test kit. Plus the low end range of your test kit only goes up to 50 ppm, which means you do not know if your level could be 100 ppm. You should make sure that you use the high end range of your nitrate kit to make sure your value is approx. 50 ppm. Personally, I have a very hard time distinguishing the colors at the range you are at and would not have much confidence in your exact level of nitrates. There is quite a span (50 - 100 ppm) in your high range color chart and very little color change. __________________ Cliff Babcock Intestests: Digital Microscopy; Marine Pest Control; Marine Plants & Macroalgae Current Tank Info: 180 g. mixed reef system Last edited by HighlandReefer; 03/21/2009 at 08:03 AM.

03/21/2009, 09:45 AM	#3
reefloverd1 returns Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: Kansas Posts: 216	thanks for your input, i know it will take time, but I want to add another trial to the tally of other experiments and maybe get some benefits out of it as well. __________________ reefloverd1 Before you criticize someone, you should walk a mile in their shoes. That way when you criticize them, you're a mile away and you have Their shoes. Current Tank Info: 14 gal. Biocube

03/21/2009, 09:52 AM	#4
reefloverd1 returns Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: Kansas Posts: 216	I dosed 0.2mL of vodka last night around 9:30pm. I will do an identical dose tonight around the same time. __________________ reefloverd1 Before you criticize someone, you should walk a mile in their shoes. That way when you criticize them, you're a mile away and you have Their shoes. Current Tank Info: 14 gal. Biocube

03/21/2009, 10:17 AM	#5
Genetics ReefKeeping Mag Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: Ontario, Ohio Posts: 4,818	reefloverd1, are you suspending water changes or do you not do water changes often? __________________ Nate Current Tank Info: Planning phase.

03/21/2009, 10:32 AM	#6
reefloverd1 returns Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: Kansas Posts: 216	yes i am suspending them, normally i do a weekly change of 6 gallons __________________ reefloverd1 Before you criticize someone, you should walk a mile in their shoes. That way when you criticize them, you're a mile away and you have Their shoes. Current Tank Info: 14 gal. Biocube

03/21/2009, 10:37 AM	#7
Genetics ReefKeeping Mag Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: Ontario, Ohio Posts: 4,818	You should think about continuation upfront. It will take you around 6 weeks to notice a difference in nitrates. __________________ Nate Current Tank Info: Planning phase.

03/21/2009, 10:46 AM	#8
reefloverd1 returns Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: Kansas Posts: 216	I am fine with the continuation. __________________ reefloverd1 Before you criticize someone, you should walk a mile in their shoes. That way when you criticize them, you're a mile away and you have Their shoes. Current Tank Info: 14 gal. Biocube

03/21/2009, 01:54 PM	#9
ccradr Registered Member Join Date: Mar 2005 Posts: 675	So you shouldnt do water changes while dosing vodka?

03/21/2009, 05:29 PM	#10
HighlandReefer Team RC Member Join Date: Aug 2008 Location: Highland, Maryland Entomologist Posts: 14,579	I would continue water changes myself. It will help to reduce your nitrate levels in your water column to some extent as well as remove possible build-up of contaminates. Water changes will also help by removing bacteria which have absorbed nitrates into their system. Good skimming practices will help to export these bacteria as well. Every little bit counts in my book. __________________ Cliff Babcock Intestests: Digital Microscopy; Marine Pest Control; Marine Plants & Macroalgae Current Tank Info: 180 g. mixed reef system

03/21/2009, 08:02 PM	#11
reefloverd1 returns Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: Kansas Posts: 216	You have a good point, I wanted to see how long it would take to get them to zero without a water change, but now considering the inhabitants,(some tube worms and several unidentified hitchhikers) it would probably be better to continue the water changes as well. Thanks highlandreefer for making me rethink my strategy. I will be dosing another 0.2mL of vodka at 9:30pm But before that I am going to do my routine water change of 6 gallons. so im going to get to it...... __________________ reefloverd1 Before you criticize someone, you should walk a mile in their shoes. That way when you criticize them, you're a mile away and you have Their shoes. Current Tank Info: 14 gal. Biocube

03/21/2009, 08:13 PM	#12
HighlandReefer Team RC Member Join Date: Aug 2008 Location: Highland, Maryland Entomologist Posts: 14,579	Your welcome. __________________ Cliff Babcock Intestests: Digital Microscopy; Marine Pest Control; Marine Plants & Macroalgae Current Tank Info: 180 g. mixed reef system

03/22/2009, 04:55 PM	#13
reefloverd1 returns Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: Kansas Posts: 216	so i did the water change and dosed 0.2 ml of vodka last night at 9:30. __________________ reefloverd1 Before you criticize someone, you should walk a mile in their shoes. That way when you criticize them, you're a mile away and you have Their shoes. Current Tank Info: 14 gal. Biocube

03/23/2009, 06:11 AM	#14
HighlandReefer Team RC Member Join Date: Aug 2008 Location: Highland, Maryland Entomologist Posts: 14,579	reefloverd1, I would be interested to hear what the average daily reduction of nitrate is for your tank after you reach your target level. Phosphate daily average would be interesting to know also, but might be harder to determine using the test kits available. Good luck. __________________ Cliff Babcock Intestests: Digital Microscopy; Marine Pest Control; Marine Plants & Macroalgae Current Tank Info: 180 g. mixed reef system

03/23/2009, 02:28 PM	#15
reefloverd1 returns Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: Kansas Posts: 216	ok, HighlandReefer i will keep more detailed data as to result in more accurate results(hopefully...lol) So I will be doing another dose of 0.2 ml of vodka tonight at...you guessed it....9:30 pm. This being the third day my dosing will go up through days 4-7(per RK mag). that will bring the new dose to 0.4mL. I thought I would also post the link to the RK mag article since I am using that as my refrence. http://reefkeeping.com/issues/2008-08/nftt/index.php __________________ reefloverd1 Before you criticize someone, you should walk a mile in their shoes. That way when you criticize them, you're a mile away and you have Their shoes. Current Tank Info: 14 gal. Biocube

03/23/2009, 03:20 PM	#16
reefloverd1 returns Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: Kansas Posts: 216	no visible change of course here is the nitrate test after only two days of dosing. I know it probably didn't change much , but I was curious to see what it wa after my water change the other day.[IMG][/IMG] And the phosphate still the same. I know I should save my tests but I want to use them up so I can buy a different brand. __________________ reefloverd1 Before you criticize someone, you should walk a mile in their shoes. That way when you criticize them, you're a mile away and you have Their shoes. Current Tank Info: 14 gal. Biocube

03/24/2009, 07:16 AM	#17
gaetanocallista Registered Member Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: Italy Posts: 141	Do you use bacteria?

03/24/2009, 02:17 PM	#18
reefloverd1 returns Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: Kansas Posts: 216	gaetanocallista, I have not used those bacteria that you can buy i.e. one and only, cycle. __________________ reefloverd1 Before you criticize someone, you should walk a mile in their shoes. That way when you criticize them, you're a mile away and you have Their shoes. Current Tank Info: 14 gal. Biocube

03/25/2009, 12:39 AM	#19
reefloverd1 returns Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: Kansas Posts: 216	3-24-09 0.4 mL vodka 9:30pm __________________ reefloverd1 Before you criticize someone, you should walk a mile in their shoes. That way when you criticize them, you're a mile away and you have Their shoes. Current Tank Info: 14 gal. Biocube

03/25/2009, 12:50 AM	#20
scaryperson27 Moved On Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: Cape Coral, F.L. Posts: 2,123	I don't like the red sea for nitrates.

03/25/2009, 12:55 AM	#21
scaryperson27 Moved On Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: Cape Coral, F.L. Posts: 2,123	Also, what are you running for filtration? An undersized skimmer will definitely seize this project from having any good results.

03/25/2009, 12:58 AM	#22
reefloverd1 returns Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: Kansas Posts: 216	scaryperson27, Â¿QuÃ© tipo de prueba le gusta usar? __________________ reefloverd1 Before you criticize someone, you should walk a mile in their shoes. That way when you criticize them, you're a mile away and you have Their shoes. Current Tank Info: 14 gal. Biocube

03/25/2009, 01:00 AM	#23
reefloverd1 returns Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: Kansas Posts: 216	Yo uso el skimmer Prizm para 100 galones. __________________ reefloverd1 Before you criticize someone, you should walk a mile in their shoes. That way when you criticize them, you're a mile away and you have Their shoes. Current Tank Info: 14 gal. Biocube

03/25/2009, 01:04 AM	#24
scaryperson27 Moved On Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: Cape Coral, F.L. Posts: 2,123	The Prizm skimmers are not all they are cracked up to be on the box. You need something that actually made to handle 100 gallons. I would suggest maybe Octopus NW-150, or Octopus DNW-150 Can you please not talk to me in spanish?

03/25/2009, 01:08 AM	#25
reefloverd1 returns Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: Kansas Posts: 216	I need the practice sorry, have an exam coming up and noone to speak spanish to. So what tests do you like? And Ill be sure to check out those skimmers! __________________ reefloverd1 Before you criticize someone, you should walk a mile in their shoes. That way when you criticize them, you're a mile away and you have Their shoes. Current Tank Info: 14 gal. Biocube