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Old 06/11/2011, 04:28 PM   #1
mwilliams62
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Reef Pods TISBE vs Tigger Pods

Can anyone tell me the difference between Reef Pods TISBE vs Tigger Pods???

Which one is better and why ????


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Old 06/11/2011, 06:09 PM   #2
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It is my understanding that the tigger pods are a cold water species that will not live in our reef tanks. The tisbe species should do well in a reef tank and are a good choice for mandarins and the like. In general the harpacticoid species of pods make good fish food.


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Old 06/11/2011, 06:21 PM   #3
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I use tigger pods in my tank and they seem to do fine and multiply like crazy


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Old 06/11/2011, 06:22 PM   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vikubz View Post
It is my understanding that the tigger pods are a cold water species that will not live in our reef tanks. The tisbe species should do well in a reef tank and are a good choice for mandarins and the like. In general the harpacticoid species of pods make good fish food.
+1 on the tisbe. It's my understanding that the tigger pods are more free swimmers found in the water column. Tisbe pods stay closer to the rock work where Mandarins like to feed.


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Old 06/11/2011, 06:29 PM   #5
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I never had luck with tigger pods.... definitely gonna try those Reef Pods


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Old 06/11/2011, 06:58 PM   #6
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thanks.. I just bought a package of the reef pods and poured the contents into my sump that i am using for a tank for my pipefush. I hope they will grow and multiply could not see them even in the package... What about that green stuff that is in the package looks like a macro algea is that safe to put in there as well???


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Old 06/11/2011, 09:28 PM   #7
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how fast do the Reef Pods TISBE multiply????


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Old 06/11/2011, 10:01 PM   #8
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I also belive that tigger pods are a cold water species I have gotten some in the past 3 different times and have not been able to keep them for long. The reef pods though are good I have used them before and my pod s are running rampant. I get a bag once every six months, I have a mandarin and just for precaution.


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Old 06/12/2011, 07:18 AM   #9
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When do you start to see them??? When I poured in the bag I saw nothing... also that little green ball of what I am assuming some type of macro algea is it okay to put in the sump/aquarium were you pour the liqiud in at???


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Old 06/12/2011, 05:39 PM   #10
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Your best bet for seeing pods is to watch on the glass. I use a magnifying glass sometimes. It helps to ID the types of pods. The really nutritious ones are also the really tiny ones. The algae won't hurt, and pods actually like to set up shop in chaeto and other macros. I have also had good results feeding a little phytoplankton to the tank.


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Old 06/12/2011, 08:04 PM   #11
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Pods (in general) multiple fast, but their ability to reproduce in your tank will be limited by available food, shelter from predators and temperature. Predators aren't only your fish, other larger pods like amphipodds and the like will eat your smaller copepods. Your ability to culture Tisbe sp. pods will then be dependent on your ability to keep out significant populations of other pods etc... in closed systems you generally end up with only one type of pod after a certain amount of time, but start off pretty diverse as things are constantly being added to the system like new live rock and frags etc.... Well that is enough run on sentences for one post.


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Old 06/12/2011, 08:05 PM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by b0bab0ey View Post
+1 on the tisbe. It's my understanding that the tigger pods are more free swimmers found in the water column. Tisbe pods stay closer to the rock work where Mandarins like to feed.
This is actually not true. Both tigriopus and tisbe copepods are harpacticoid and are both benthic (spends the majority of its time on substrate and surfaces).

It is also a myth that tigriopus copepods are only "coldwater" species. Yes a majority of the species are found in colder waters but those that are collected for the aquarium trade are actually collected in warmer waters. Tigriopus copepods will thrive and multiply in our warmer water reef tanks just fine. IMO those that blame tigriopus copepods not thriving in their systems due to it being a coldwater species are not providing the right conditions for the pods to multiply.

I culture both tisbe and tigriopus copepods and they are both cultured at the same temp and same water parameters.

Edit:

Hi John ^^


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Old 06/12/2011, 08:50 PM   #13
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for now all i have in the tank is a small pipefish and a very tiny blenny .... What do I need to feed these pods with in order for them to multiply with. I aslo have a small patch of macro algae trying to get it to grow as well and it is not growing as fast as i would like it to don't know what I am doing wrong.


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Old 06/12/2011, 10:42 PM   #14
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Hello Kris!

You would want to feed pods something like phyto, they eat decaying food, but phyto would work faster. It is better to do in a separate culture tank. Newly hatched brine, (not brine that was hatched awhile ago, but newly hatched) will work for the pipefish for now. You will want to "gutload" the brine if you continue using it until a more suitable live food is available for the pipefish. Blennies are pretty diverse, which species? THey generally aren't finicky.


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Old 06/12/2011, 10:56 PM   #15
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Randy Reed talked to our club recently about the Tigger pods. He says they are found in cold water, but they live naturally in tidepools. They chose them because they can live from 34degrees all the way up over 100 degrees. As tidepools evaporate, they can take more than double salinity all the way down to half salinity with almost no acclimation. They have to be a cold water tolerant species so they can live in the refrigerator.

I've got them in my fuge now.


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Old 06/12/2011, 11:06 PM   #16
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Hi Reefcleaners my name is Mary from the above. Thanks for the info I will go and pick up a bottle of phyto. I have tried hathing the brine shrimp and have not been able get them to go down to the bottom of the container away from the eggs at the top. so I have been havig to buy the adult live brine shrimp he "pipefish" chumps down on about 3 or 4 and that is all I see him eat. I tried the frozen PE Mysis but he will not eat it or at least not while I am in there watching him. I have already lost one pipefish but he was much smaller then the other one. The Blenny is I beleive to be a Molly about one inch for now. I don't even know were he came from beign that little unless my other blennies had a baby and it was hiding all this time. The bigger mollies I have moved to another tank so they would not eat the Pupfish. So I want to give my Pipefish the very best for him to grow and nourishment that he needs..

Mary


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Old 06/13/2011, 11:02 AM   #17
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Thanks guys for all of your advise it has helped me out. Now get them to multiply and grow.


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Old 06/14/2011, 07:44 PM   #18
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Tigger-Pods (Tigriopus californicus) will NOT grow well in your main display tank. They don't instinctively hide from fish, are very large easy to find, and they often starve in reef systems because there is not enough microalgae for them to feed on. They grow best in your refugium or simulated tide pool (a 9x13 cake pan works perfectly!).

Tigger-Pods commonly live in tide pools and range from Canada to Honduras, from very cold water to very warm water. They are definitely not just a "cold water species". Due to their wide temperature tolerance they can be stored in cold hibernation for up to 8 weeks, hence why they are kept in the refrigerator at your local fish store. Hibernation reduces their need for oxygen and food, and extends their lives.

Their optimal growing temperatures depends on where the broodstock were originally harvest. Our broodstock population was collected in California where tide pool temperatures can approach 100 F so they are acclimated to temperatures at or above reef system. We've been culturing them at 75-90 F for over 6 years.

.......................

Tigriopus californicus don't live in the ocean - they live in the warm splash zone pools up above the ocean. These pools are shallow and get quite warm during the day, some much warmer than reef systems. The following published scientific study shows that they live in temperatures ranging from 42 to 92 F:

http://journals.cambridge.org/action...25315498000095

In these tide pools there are no predators so they don't have the instincts to hide in the rocks when fish come by. Since they don't hide they get eaten pretty quickly in display tanks. We recommend they be cultured in a sump or refugium where there are no predators. They can also be easily cultured in a separate system like a 9x13 cake pan.

The population of copepods in a reef system is often food limited by the amount of natural microalgae that the reef system produces each day. When additional pods are added the food requirements immediately goes up, especially when feeding very large copepods like Tigger-Pods. Unfortunately many people don't realize they need to supplement with microalgae so both the Tigger-Pods and the existing copepod population end up with a food shortage and quickly starve.

The analogy I use when I'm giving presentations is "If you have an acre of land that produces enough grass to support one cow but want to have lots of cows - what do you do? You add bales of hay and suddenly that 1 acre will support LOTS of cows".

Microalgae is like hay to your zooplankton. The more you add, the more zooplankton you will have. If you don't have enough, they starve and disappear.


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Old 06/14/2011, 11:26 PM   #19
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Randy,

Thank you very much for taking a minute to reply to this thread, your wisdom is much appreciated!

----------

Just to throw out some more knowledge I asked Randy a question a couple months back about feeding the pods; here is a copy/paste of our conversation (hope its ok Randy, just want to share the knowledge).

Quote:
Hello,

I would like to get your tigger pods but have a question. Pretty much everywhere I read it states the best phyto for copepods is Nanochloropsus (most nutritious) yet on your website you state:

They can also feed on green algae such as Nannochloropsis and Tetraselmis, however most of these algae will pass right through their digestive tracts and not provide any nutrition.

Can you explain this a bit more, why would so many places recommend this algae to culture for copepods? If nano is not the best algae to feed pods what would be the best to feed them?

Thanks for your help!

Kris
Quote:
Hi Kris,



I don’t know if Nanno by itself works, but I do know our mixed diet (Phyto-Feast) of Nanno, Tetraselmis, Pavlova, Isochrysis, and Thalassiosira works very well. My best guess is that Nanno is a bit small and has a tougher cell wall than Tiggers would prefer. Tet should work perfectly well, even though it also has a tough cell wall. The brown algae are very nutritious and have easily digest membrane walls.



I hope this is helpful,



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Hope that helps you guys, it sure did help me


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Old 06/16/2011, 08:53 AM   #20
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Thank you Randy and everyone who has helped me on this thread.

I am trying to grow them in my sump that I was going to sale into a tank because I have run out of tanks to put my pipefish in it is not setup with my DT at this time and no other fish except for a very tiny blenny that is in there and he will be moved to another tank later on today he maybe he is barely one inch. I have added a small patch of chaeto and caulprea in there as well. i also purchased some PhytoPlex "Aqua-Cultured Phytoplankton" to put in there till I can start my own culture.

The Tigger Pods that I see at the lfs they keep them in a small refrigerator 8oz bottle can I pour the whole bottle into my make shift tank/sump???? Do I need to ket it become room temp before adding ???

Mary


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Old 06/16/2011, 11:48 AM   #21
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Mary - It's possible to culture them to your sump, however they might get pushed out depending on how high the flow rate is. They can be added directly from the cold bottles to your sump, however I'd suggest letting them warm up to room temperature first.

By far the most successful way to culture them is in a simulated tide-pool, and a 9x13 glass cake pan works perfectly for that. It will be about 30 days until you see results, but after that you can scoop them out regularly.

Hope this helps


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Old 06/16/2011, 12:10 PM   #22
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By far the most successful way to culture them is in a simulated tide-pool, and a 9x13 glass cake pan works perfectly for that. It will be about 30 days until you see results, but after that you can scoop them out regularly.
Hope this helps
Randy,

Can you give more details on the simulated tidepool approach? I currently culture tigriopus copepods in a 5 gallon bucket with roti's and feed nanno paste daily. The results are ho-hum.

So..
culture container - 9"x13" glass pan
Temperature - ambient room?
Salinity - 35ppt work?
Lighting - Indirect ambient room light?
Circulation - Rigid tubing (1,2 - bubble count?)
Food - (If phytopheast - then wouldn't some of the algae be wasted since they prefer dynoflagellate's?) (maybe a Iso paste?)

Any other tips to help along a culture?

Thanks Randy!

btw great conversation, good to have Randy and John giving input here!


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Old 06/16/2011, 12:44 PM   #23
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Let me see if I can help

Culture container - anything that is long, wide, at least 2 inches high. Cake pans are a perfect example. If you get deeper than 2-3 inches you have to add an airstone.

Temperature - room temp. Anything from 60-85 is optimal.

Salinity - 30 ppt to 40 ppt. They are used to the tide pools evaporating during the day and the salinity going up.

Circulation - not needed, especially in a shallow system.

Lighting - ambient

Food - Phyto-Feast or Shellfish Diet, they like variety. Nanno is the least effective species for them.

When you have a good population going simply scoop some out and feed them to your tank. Then replace the water in the "tidepool". If you are replacing it with water from your aquarium I'd pour it through a coffee filter first to keep other organisms out.


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Old 06/16/2011, 03:49 PM   #24
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Randy,

1. How fast do tiger pods reproduce? For example, how many eggs do they lay per life time?
2. What's the life span? Weeks? Months?
3. How much do we need to feed the pods? Once or multiple times per day?
4. Typically, how many pods can live in a 9x13 glass cake pan?


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Old 06/16/2011, 04:19 PM   #25
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1. How fast do tiger pods reproduce? For example, how many eggs do they lay per life time?
** I'll see if I can find that out and get back to you.

2. What's the life span? Weeks? Months?
** My understanding is their lifespan is about 100 days

3. How much do we need to feed the pods? Once or multiple times per day?
** 2-3 times a week should be fine. They have a MUCH slower metabolism than rotifers.

4. Typically, how many pods can live in a 9x13 glass cake pan?
** Good question - I'll see if I can get an answer for you.


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