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Old 10/13/2011, 07:51 PM   #1
brandon429
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pico reef pest algae problem challenge

Anyone out there got some red brush algae they've been hating on for a few months now?
How about some bryopsis, or some green hair algae around your favorite zoanthid plug.

want to show you an alternate method you may not have seen.

Maybe someone out there has a headache algae spot (any genus) to post in this thread, we can all track its demise. If its green it will be dead by Monday. If its brown or red gimme into next week then its gone.
\ Wish someone would have shown it to me in 04 it would have saved the first reefbowl from asparagopsis death. thought it might be a fun idea to do an algae focus thread with before and after pics of problem spots free of algae.

B



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Old 10/18/2011, 06:12 PM   #2
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OK Brandon,I'm in, what's your miracle cure ?




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Old 10/19/2011, 11:32 AM   #3
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I feel like I'm falling for a sales pitch that I can't see coming....but am still subscribing


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Old 11/22/2011, 06:56 AM   #4
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no sale

For this thread I wanted to follow a different path. rather than posting something and it turning into a theory back and forth, the ideal would be to have someone that has a spot of algae they can't beat, we do a little wizardry in pm, they show back up with the spot in a couple days to show the loss of it. then we talk about how that worked, if any of you know don't spoil it lets have fun. for once we'll post proof first, its something you already have in your house but again no guesses its more fun to kill algae first.

if anyone has a single spot or area of invasive micro or macro algae in their tank that they haven't been able to beat following all the usual rules put up a pic and lets run this test.



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Old 11/22/2011, 09:02 AM   #5
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Hmmm, sounds interesting... Not sure if I want to be a test dummy though, hahaha.


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Old 11/22/2011, 09:08 PM   #6
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I promise nothing will happen. if you want to try it, post up a pic of your algae target so we can see it. I'll give you all the scoop in pm to keep the suprise going and if you aren't convinced it will work with the link I send you we can just leave the pic up and wait for the next contestant. In no way will this hurt someone's tank I wouldn't do that to you guys. I only prescribe what I use personally. somewhere out there someone is so fed up with X algae they wouldn't care much either way, but even if its just a spot on your favorite zoanthids we can free it of algae within two days.


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Old 11/22/2011, 09:09 PM   #7
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Newman dont leak it man!!


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Old 11/23/2011, 11:51 AM   #8
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Sounds interesting. I would volunteer my tank but I don't have issues right now .

Brandon is a great reefer if you have never read his posts before.


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Old 12/11/2011, 05:00 PM   #9
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Interested in what this may be


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Old 12/11/2011, 06:12 PM   #10
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lets run the thread with pics of before


then by tues nite
zap its white and falling off the rocks...


after pics

most of these threads turn into theory debates I thought just for once pics only was the way to go
then we can talk about why the method works, not if it will...
try just a single spot of algae and see what this does.

put a pic of a target area...

there are 4 people running the test now in pm if they don't think im crazy heh. guess we'll see if pics are made. I could post my own before and after pics but its not as good as taking a skeptic down the road of algae loss.



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Old 12/11/2011, 08:05 PM   #11
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At the risk of sounding like I'm bragging I don't have any nuisance algae issues either. A valonia here or there but but they just get removed with a hemostat.

Someone here can step up with some hair algae, bryopsis or dictyota ??


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Old 12/12/2011, 06:42 AM   #12
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I have light hair algae in my tank. Its barely there but it is noticable. The most i have found was in my overflow. i believe my outbreak is from Bad RO water and old lamps. Currently running phosban. I do not have a current picture of the algae but i do have some light hair algae on the lower bottom portions of the glass and overflow.


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Old 12/12/2011, 07:15 AM   #13
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Very interesting..I have a rock or two that I can't keep clean of hair algea..do I dare admit it..

Sorry didn't realize I was in the nano section..not a nano here..


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Last edited by Ohiomom; 12/12/2011 at 07:28 AM. Reason: not a nano tank :(
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Old 12/12/2011, 09:22 AM   #14
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Can we get a time line/frame please?


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Old 12/12/2011, 01:03 PM   #15
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The timeline to remove green hair algae off any surface is two days, totally gone. red growths take 4 to 5 ish

ohio mom can you post a pic of your target area this still works in large tanks depending on placement of the bad algae. can you remove the rock from your tank to treat externally for a few mins and then place back in the tank>?

Someone is going to leak this soon anyway so I will

its peroxide. its not crazy, its the best algae cure Ive ever seen in a decade. what it does for my tanks and about 100 I run through various pm's on boards is amazing. Was going to offer it to RC with a guided thread to show its freakish power. Nearly everything we have been told about peroxide use in the nano reef is patently wrong, much like when big tank keepers were just sure pico reefs wouldn't last very long due to instability, allelopathy etc

There are threads on RC about it, with many posits that are incorrect (it will wipe out a reef tank etc)

You don't just dump it in your tank, there is a specific way to use it called a spot treatment. If you want a reference thread at nano-reef.com in the disease and pest forum there is a thread with nearly 30K views for a reason, it works. Used exactly in the right manner it will harm nothing in your tank, only kill the algae.

There are many tanks that keep pristine water and still develop algae. Same happens on natural reefs when the tangs die out or are overfished etc, algae will grow in pristine waters. This was just another way of manual removal that's fast and saves you from tedious water tinkering. I used to fire burn my algae with a lighter, this is faster.

I wanted to try the thread with proof pics first but that reference thread has plenty. If anyone wants to use simple peroxide in an easy manner we can guide the use here and make your tank success number 101. Nothing in your tank will be harmed except for the algae.
B

so, if everyone isn't scared off now lol who is going to post the first party pic


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Old 12/12/2011, 01:09 PM   #16
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number one assumption made when a person gets past the original hesitation of using it in the tank

-if you don't correct the source of the problem, it will just keep coming back.

of course thats true, and if you don't refresh your GFO or increase your water changes your phosphate will come back. everything needs retouching/regeneration in our tanks peroxide is not a one off use trick. its a management tool

There are tweaked ways to use it Ive found to prevent glass scraping for example, its just one tweak of many possible. When my tank is drained for a water change, I wipe the inside walls with a paper towel wet w per and nothing grows on the glass. no coralline, no green haze on a six year old reef etc, so it solved the constant problem I had of scratching up my glass to keep the green haze off. Not every tank can use this trick but most can. Tanks with decorative macro algaes and lysmata cleaner shrimp need to use external spot treatments, but since I don't have any of these the in tank treatment works for me. New peroxide use should be guided and specific for whats in the tank. There are only a few tank designs that preclude its use, its helpful for the vast majority of nano tank keepers.


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Old 12/12/2011, 03:35 PM   #17
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I knew it could be used as a dip for zoa issues but not algae. Interesting.


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Old 12/13/2011, 06:09 AM   #18
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Brandon I can remove a few pieces to treat externally and would be willing to give it a shot if it doesn't harm corals..course the pieces I would pull would not have corals on them...

I would really appreciate more info on it..


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Old 12/13/2011, 07:28 AM   #19
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so happy you want to try it will give others confidence. This is the treatment, even before I see pics i know it will work. Remove the target rocks from the tank, drip straight 3% peroxide on the targets, just enough drops to saturate the algae. if its a small tuft use one or two drops. let sit on the target for 2 to 3 mins (when treating I regularly leave my pico with 15 genera of mixed stony and soft corals emersed for 5 or more 2 to 3 is a safe zone)

rinse off the area and place back in tank. algae turns white within just a couple days. if you want to speed up the process, repeat in two days even as its turning white.

this method imports no peroxide into your tank. Even if you add a few drops peroxide directly to the tank, the net effect is a small raise in systemic oxygen. heavily diluted peroxide is no antibacterial, its an oxygen booster. Its important to know peroxide has been dumped into reef tanks by many a pet store during power outages, its no stranger to the tank. If you google around enough, you will see peroxide being used as an oxygen crutch in freshwater and marine tanks for years and years. All we are doing here is utilizing that extra oxygen molecule to overpower the photosystems of algae.

Oxygen is liberated in photosynthesis because it is a free radical destroyer of cells in the plant making carbohydrates. I suspect the net effect of peroxide on target algae is a backup in this system, just like oxygen is great at the surface and toxic at depth for a scuba diver, we are using this fast dissipating gas to attack algae. its one of many ways but its probably the fastest way to kill GHA there is.

green hair algae is the most susceptible growth in our tanks, it will absolutely die even with a small spot treatment. post before and after pics if you will!
B


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Old 12/13/2011, 07:34 AM   #20
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here is the reading thread but lets discuss it here and get some proofs unique to rc on the matter

http://www.nano-reef.com/forums/inde...owtopic=268706

Most tanks do not need radical water treatment to have a layout free of algae. You absolutely do not have to attain zero nitrates and phosphates to be free of algae. Simple manual removal works, its the point of this thread.

This chemical burning of the algae is different from rock scrubbing. That disperses fragments all over the tank and conserves whatever biomass is left in the water, to reseed. The oxidation burning from peroxide targeting kills the organism thoroughly, and despite assumptions from non treaters, it does not grow back faster.

The key after the initial treatment after your rocks are totally clean is catching the algae when its the size of a pencil eraser going forward, no more hands off watching your clean up crew crawl over the spot and not eat it, as it grows. Its about intercepting the growth immediately, arrest it before it grows.

Probably my favorite usage of peroxide is on my bowl, which is susceptible to red brush algae invasion due to my local fish stores biota on frags we buy. red brush algae is always a devastating hitchhiker, it has nothing to do with water quality whatsoever.
Nowadays when I see some down low in the tank I have no worries. Whenever I feel like placing a drop on the growth I know it will die within the next week.

Peroxide is literally the cure for red brush algae, theres no excuse to have a tank laden with it going forward. To heck with turbo snails and urchins, I want the stuff gone for sure. Clean up crews are always hit and miss, this stuff isnt.

we see bryopsis-prone tanks needing retreatments, theres no telling how many holdfasts and progenerative bits of material are bound in the rocks when bryopsis is allowed to progress before the treatment. All you have to do is keep retreating the spots along with improvements in water quality, some have even combined peroxide with elevated magnesium levels to target the tough bryopsis tank.
If you will just catch any organism when it is a tiny, new community it can't overtake your tank. We've even killed the dreaded string diatoms with peroxide, everything dies.

Dictyota Id be interested to see Agu we have no threads on that genus but I place my money on peroxide killing it as a spot treatment.



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Old 12/13/2011, 01:48 PM   #21
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Peroxide

Brandon, I've got a skunk cleaner shrimp in my 28 nano. Any special precauctions needed when i target the algae? i think I read somewhere they are very sensitive to H202.
Thanks N


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Old 12/13/2011, 03:14 PM   #22
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--

Yes Sir Id recommend not dosing the tank at all, rather removing the target rocks and treating externally then rinsing well in sw before reinstalling the rock

I know removing rocks is no fun but it at least gives you a chance to remove detritus up under them w nice big water changes matching temp and sg

this method of external tank treatment imports none back into the main tank after a nice rinse. this works for tanks with cleaner shrimp and decorative macros. ya'll better lob some pics at this thread nobody likes all verbiage lol I'll try to find some of mine when I get off work tonite and put up.
Newman and Reefmiser also gave me permission to use some of theirs I may.


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Old 12/13/2011, 06:53 PM   #23
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I will post pics but will probably not be able to do it until Thurs. I have two sick kids at home..


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Old 12/13/2011, 07:51 PM   #24
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hope you get em well thats not a fun start to Christmas break. I just noticed a small spot of green hair algae in my bowl will do pics on that removal. will have to scrape a photo window in the coralline so the patch can be seen but it will be a nice documentation.


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Old 12/14/2011, 11:57 AM   #25
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Brandon - how goes it bud?

Is there a reason you would advocate using peroxide over a product like Chemi-Clean. I have had great luck using it to kill the amounts of Cyano in my tank (along with physical removal and working to control my phosphates). Just to play Devil's Advocate, why would I chose the more time consuming task of peroxide scrubbing, which could impact other beneficial orgamisms vs the strategy I'm currently using?


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