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Old 06/24/2012, 07:23 AM   #351
BeanAnimal
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Aimforever View Post
Based on the spread and par I am getting on my frag tank I believe you would need roughly 6 of the regular 350s to approach the brightness of 2x 400 watt radiums for a 48x24x24 tank.
That is a 2 x 150 watt metal halide tank that will stustain anything anywhere in the tank. Using 2 x 250 watt bulbs on a tank of those dimensions would be suitable but approaching (if not certainly) overkill. There is simply no way on this planet that a 4' tank needs 2 x 400 Watt halides under any circumstances. I am not defending the Kessil lights (hell, most folks around here think I am an LED hater) but being upset that (2) LED fixtures that consume a total of ~200W are not as bright as (2) MH that consume ~1000W is kind of silly. I don't think any reasonable person expects a 100W pendant to be able to compete with a 500W fixture. LEDs are growing in efficiency, but still nowhere near 5x more efficient than conventional arc lamps.

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I have no regrets getting the a350w & I really do like it. I just think I set my expectations unfairly high in thinking that a single a350w could cover my 36x36x6 frag tank, and should have got at least 2 right off the bat.
That is more reasonable. The depth is not really the issue, it is the spread and basic physics at work (the inverse square law). (2) wides tilted slightly in to overlap at the same 9" height would likely be ok. You will still have weaker corners than the middle, but it will help. The problem is the square shape and 2 fixtures with a round radiation pattern. You have to be high enough to cover front to back and that is the same distance from side to side.



Last edited by BeanAnimal; 06/24/2012 at 07:34 AM.
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Old 06/24/2012, 12:26 PM   #352
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Originally Posted by BeanAnimal View Post
That is a 2 x 150 watt metal halide tank that will stustain anything anywhere in the tank. Using 2 x 250 watt bulbs on a tank of those dimensions would be suitable but approaching (if not certainly) overkill. There is simply no way on this planet that a 4' tank needs 2 x 400 Watt halides under any circumstances. I am not defending the Kessil lights (hell, most folks around here think I am an LED hater) but being upset that (2) LED fixtures that consume a total of ~200W are not as bright as (2) MH that consume ~1000W is kind of silly. I don't think any reasonable person expects a 100W pendant to be able to compete with a 500W fixture. LEDs are growing in efficiency, but still nowhere near 5x more efficient than conventional arc lamps.
You must have misread my posts since I certainly never stated that I was upset that the Kessils didn't have the same output as a 400w MH. That would be absurd. I was just trying to help answer the OP's question about switching from 400w radions to A350s and felt that it would take roughly 3x 350s to deliver similar output. Whether or not this is overkill for a particular sized tank is sort of irrelevant to the original question.

I disagree that 2x 250w halides is "approaching (if not certainly) overkill" for a 120 gallon tank, but of course that is just my opinion based on my successes and preferences. For many years I used 2x 250s + 4x 54 watt T5s over a 120 with excellent results and I would hesitate to even call that overkill. I know a few reefers who use 400w radions over their similar sized tanks also with excellent results. I agree perhaps it is approaching overkill, but to say "there is no way on this planet under any circumstances..." is pretty close minded. At the end of the day all that matters is are you getting good growth and do you like the way it looks. There are an infinite number of ways to acheive that and the kessils are certianly one great option.



Last edited by Aimforever; 06/24/2012 at 12:35 PM.
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Old 06/24/2012, 02:01 PM   #353
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Before; A150W Sky Blue 10K (this has been on there for 10 months.)
What is that in the bottom left of your tank? it looks like 2 jelly fish... I didn't see them in any other pic.


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Old 06/27/2012, 04:35 PM   #354
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Alex T,

I don't have a sps dominated tank but i do have some sps near the sand bed probably 5 inches off the sand bed. More of the monipora that covers the rocks. Porite variety. I could not tell you if you could actually grow them on the sand bed though. I had VHO lighting and MH before. I would say your Radiums are going to have more punch than the Kessil. That being said, i do have the wide angle variety that spreads more than punches down. I would think you would need 3 of them to cover your tank but i can't speak for the A350 that doesn't go wide. I have two A350W lights covering my 48" tank perfect. I can't complain. I have them going 100 percent though. I never thought i would like that blue but it brings the colors out nice and my corals are loving the new LED's. I have had some for over 10 years and they adjusted great. The temp drop is incredible though. Nice cool water here for my Florida tank and the corals love it.The only thing i will say about them is the converter gives off some heat. I thought they would be warm but they are quite hot. You put that underneath your tank anyway so it shouldn't be a problem. I would go with 3 A350W but you would have to be the judge of that one. Hope this helps. Oh, my lights are 9.5 inches off the water also. My rock structure? I would have to say i have an sps about the size of a softball or better and its about 8 to 10 inches below the water. I'm guessing though. The higher you go with them, the more they angle out for better coverage. For the size of the lights, they are bright. I am impressed.




For all the reefers that are currently using the Kessil a350/a350w on their aquariums, can you please post pictures?

Explanations of your aquariums are nice and all, but it would really be more beneficial to see pictures of the coverage and corals.




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Old 06/27/2012, 04:45 PM   #355
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I actually think the explanations are more useful. There's already a few good pictures on here.


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Old 06/27/2012, 05:02 PM   #356
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I actually think the explanations are more useful. There's already a few good pictures on here.
Buddythelion, I agree with your comment.

I just figured that it would enhance a post to see pictures of peoples aquariums. Especially when a few reefers stated that the brightness isn't as great compared to their VHO's or MH's.


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Old 06/28/2012, 06:32 AM   #357
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wes42079:

Photos are useless at conveying color and brightness. There are too many variables from the room lighting (amount and color) to the camera settings (exposure, white balance, compression, etc) to the software settings used to process the image and lastly the computer and monitor the photo is viewed on.

Want to see what they look like? See them in person


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Old 06/28/2012, 07:17 PM   #358
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Hey,

Could one of you that has a 350 please tell me what size hole is needed to allow the light to slide thru. I am getting my 30" x 15" heatsink made and i need to tell them hole size needed drilled for pricing?

Thank You!


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Old 06/30/2012, 06:42 AM   #359
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go on kessil's website and the dimensions are there. All i can say for the LED's so far is all my corals are loving the new lights and i am getting some good color out of the corals. It has been 3 weeks since i installed the lights. My experience only.


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Old 06/30/2012, 09:51 AM   #360
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Thank You lgull1,

I found it after i posted Yeah i am liking the lights too the more i research them.


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Old 07/01/2012, 01:22 PM   #361
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Here's some shots of my 93g cube tank. 30x30x24 I'm running the kessil a350w at about four to five inches above the water. I love how it looks and it lights up the whole tank. Corals seem very happy as well.





This picture is when the tank was going thru the cycle I think. But it shows the light





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Old 07/01/2012, 03:12 PM   #362
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I've been running an A350W over my 40 Breeder frag tank for about a week now.
I've been running EcoTech Radions over my other tanks for several months now.

The Kessil is surprisingly small, and light.
I dont like the goose neck mount for it. The base that mounts to the tank is not the most secure thing in the world at all. It consists of a metal U bar that houses a nylon block as a tank rim adaptor. You use nylon thumb screws to secure the nylon block to the side of the metal U bar. This is adjustable for height.
You then use nylon thumb screws to secure the metal U bar to the tank rim. The nylon thumb screws are the weak point of this mounting system.

IMO, for nearly the same amount of money, the Grip Lock Radion hanging kit is better than the Gooseneck mount. Its easier to adjust, and much more secure.

The Kessil is more like a Metal Halide in terms of appearance than any other LED light I've seen thus far. With just one optic, it looks identical to a MH. The Radions have a little bit of the disco ball look with regards to the "Shimmer" but not much and not distracting to me. You get used to it and dont see it after a little while.

With both channels at 100%, the light closely looks like a 14K Hamilton MH on IceCap or electronic ballasts.

The Radions at 100% look almost identical to the 250 W14K Phoenix lights powered by a PFO HQI Ballast. Basically more white with a crisp blue look to them. The Kessil looks more blue.

The Kessil is either on, or off. You can control the intensity levels of the two channels, but that's about it.

The Radions are able to be programmed to ramp up or down at pre-programmed times. I didnt find the Radions to be as easy to program as they are advertised, but then again, I'm a former infantry Marine who is now a cop, not a Rocket Surgeon.

40 Frag tank contains SPS frags, a few softies, and clams. Based solely on the way the softies are shrinking down while the Kessil is on, I would bet that it produces more than enough PAR to grow my acros and maintain colors. For frame of reference, the Frag tank used to have a 250 W Phoenix 14k SE powered by a Sunlight Supply Galaxy Select A Watt E Ballast set at 250 watt usage, (not 250 HQI or higher, just regular 250W). The Softies used to shrink down in the same manner and the same amount under the MH as it does under the Kessil.

Between the two, I personally prefer the Radions for the better color variations, and for the ability to ramp up/down throughout the photo period. But that is solely my opinion. And you do pay almost double the price of a Kessil for those and other abilities of the Radions.

Overall, the only negative I honestly have about the Kessil is the Gooseneck mount. Otherwise, I think its a well made light and will do quite well on the market.

One thing to note about the Kessil is that with just one optic and and the LED's being a combined array, if they burn out or malfunction, you're going to have to send in the whole light for any sort of repairs. I doubt there will be many repairs to be made, and with Kessil's history in the horticulture side of things, I bet they knew what they were doing.

With the Radion, in theory, its possible for Eco-Tech to send you a replacement puck to repair a bad side.

Just my thoughts, and worth exactly what you paid for them.

Nick


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Old 07/03/2012, 01:12 AM   #363
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Since the kessil a350 only has two channels, one blue and one white, would you kessil owners say that the red colors in the coral not as vibrant as T5 and rather washed out? I'm trying to think how coral "pop" is any different from the AI Sol Blue.


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Old 07/03/2012, 08:00 AM   #364
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Since the kessil a350 only has two channels, one blue and one white, would you kessil owners say that the red colors in the coral not as vibrant as T5 and rather washed out? I'm trying to think how coral "pop" is any different from the AI Sol Blue.
I cant speak for the A350 but I have two A150's. They use the same leds for both lights though. I can say that reds do absolutely pop. My red BTA is a bright red crimson. My red setosa is also a deep red. I added two T5's to supplement the smaller Kessils and the colors look more washed out with them on. They have at least five different color leds in the lights and I'm assuming the whites are a little warmer to help with reds. I honestly haven't seen a color that showed up poorly under my Kessils. I'm upgrading to the A350W's in a few weeks and am anxious to take the T5's out.

One other point. The two channels on the A350 are not separate blue/white channels. Channel 1 is their 10k spectrum, which still includes blue. Channel 2 is their 20k spectrum which is all blue Leds.


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Old 07/03/2012, 01:34 PM   #365
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I am lovin that cube LittleBee. Very nice set up.


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Old 07/03/2012, 01:36 PM   #366
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What is that in the bottom left of your tank? it looks like 2 jelly fish... I didn't see them in any other pic.
LOL yeahhhh. Those are the fake jellies from eshopps. I took them out when no one was looking. ALOT of people that walked by that and saw those did a double take and thought they were real until they got up very close and saw the string.


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Old 07/03/2012, 02:32 PM   #367
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I'm thinking of replacing an ATI power module 60" with two A350w units for my 5 foot 150 gallon tank. Do you think this would work well? The power module tends to nuke things.. So a little less light would be a good thing for soft corals and lps.

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Old 07/03/2012, 02:43 PM   #368
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I'm thinking of replacing an ATI power module 60" with two A350w units for my 5 foot 150 gallon tank. Do you think this would work well? The power module tends to nuke things.. So a little less light would be a good thing for soft corals and lps.

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If you're doing LPS and softies i think you will be very happy with the A350W wide angels.


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Old 07/03/2012, 03:39 PM   #369
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I'm doing a mix if SPS and everything else, but I am planning on just keeping SPS on the rock higher up and the rest lower.. Pretty standard.

I'm just worried about spread on my five foot tank.

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Old 07/03/2012, 05:23 PM   #370
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Great write-up maxxII! Another note about the goose neck is to make sure you don't allow the water to touch the anodized metal. I followed the directions and installed my a350 on my rimless tank and submerged the anodized metal bracket. Within 4-5 days it started to corrode and I quickly took it out and contacted Kessil about the issue. Fortunately, they did some testing and didn't see any harmful affects. I chose to still do a water change and was given a new bracket as a replacement. (Awesome customer service!!!) I now have it installed but I raised it up a bit so it's not resting on the tank rim anymore. Just an fyi for those with rimless tanks.


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Old 07/03/2012, 08:25 PM   #371
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This thread has been moved to the current forum.


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Old 07/03/2012, 10:17 PM   #372
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Smile

With all white turned off and blue at 100% does the A350 look more blue, less blue, or equal to the A150 20K I want to know before I buy one.


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Old 07/03/2012, 10:21 PM   #373
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Significantly more blue.


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Old 07/03/2012, 10:26 PM   #374
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would anyone else like to comment on the red coloration in corals under kessil a350 or a350w?


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Old 07/04/2012, 07:17 AM   #375
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I only have a single pink Monti cap frag under the Kessil...

It looks just fine. More "pop" than was showing under the 250w Phoenix SE bulb before...


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