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Old 04/10/2016, 05:08 PM   #3526
DNA
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Some Ostreopsis there swinging and hanging on their flagella.
You got a good shot of it on pic 1, close to the bottom.


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Old 04/10/2016, 06:20 PM   #3527
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Some Ostreopsis there swinging and hanging on their flagella.
You got a good shot of it on pic 1, close to the bottom.
Wonderful, what I was afraid of!


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Old 04/10/2016, 07:40 PM   #3528
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Unions are your friend. They're expensive, but they can make a complex reef into a system of LEGO-like blocks. Flexibility and ease is key. In case of crisis, they're always there when you need them. They got your back in the middle of the night when nothing else works. It's a true friend that waits patiently and responds immediately when you call on them.
((Tearing up here with emotion))... No, seriously - use them.

I understand the sponge loop. I use my chaeto and cryptic zones to create a flow of life. There's always some flow through my cryptic zone, but it's ~1/10th my main flow that's about 4000gph... so maybe 400gph? That's a guesstimate since I can't really measure it.

The featherdusters are parasitic... they grow everywhere. The coralline prefers darker environments. It grows far from my halides. The cryptic zone only gets the faintest light refracted though the acrylic front. I think that there are difference species of coralline... I haven't found the one that likes direct intense light.

Interesting concept of an algae-dominant microbiome... Need to think and read up on that.


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Old 04/11/2016, 02:38 PM   #3529
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Originally Posted by karimwassef
Interesting concept of an algae-dominant microbiome... Need to think and read up on that.
It's just a pet theory...


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Originally Posted by 34cygni
I'd bet good money that coralline is the canary in the coral mine signalling that the bacteria population in an aquarium is shifting away from the coral-friendly bunch that we want and towards dino-friendly types. And as I looked into this, I found that the bacteriological warfare going on between corals and dinos is just one aspect of the general competitive struggle for ecological dominance between corals and primary producers...
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Originally Posted by 34cygni
But it's probably Proteobacteria associated with other primary producers that outcompete the dino-friendly bacteria for labile DOC in healthy systems. Nutrient-limited algae dump excess photosynthate into the water column when the lights are on, so I'd expect the bacterioplankton population in a closed, recirculating, oligotrophic system to be dominated by algae-friendly bacteria. That would explain the low level DDAM effects reported on Santa Monica's site a few years back and why many hobbyists have difficulty growing coralline and keeping it healthy.
...but it seems like a reasonable extrapolation from this:

Influence of coral and algal exudates on microbially mediated reef metabolism
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/arti...erj-01-108.pdf


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Old 04/12/2016, 05:48 AM   #3530
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Poking around in Google Scholar turned up a link between the B12 economy and the Roseobacter bacteria clade, which you may recall from page 101. Turns out rosies are big into B12 synthesis. As of 2015, of the >50 rosies that have had their DNA sequenced, every single one had the genes for making B12. This makes sense given how tight rosies are with algae, and since rosies are involved, naturally that means organic sulfur is part of the B12 economy.
heh. Been telling myself for a while I ought to actually read your whole megapost on p101. Lots of ideas I've toyed with came from searches that flagged small sections of the megapost.


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Have you tried Fe + B12 to see if that moves the needle on N or P? Colimitation by B12 and Fe has been observed in "high nitrate low chlorophyll" regions of the ocean. You might also try playing around with different combinations of B12, Fe, and Si to see if you can trigger diatom growth, as HNLC regions are typically low in dissolved Si, too.
Haven't tried B12+Fe, until yesterday. Co-limitation is complicated. :-)
funny you mention high nutrient low chlorophyll (HNLC) research. a couple of weeks ago, I realized how relevant HNLC was. It's what I've been aiming to create in my water column - available macronutrients and light, but with some crucial micronutrient(s) removed actively by chaeto/caulerpa leading to low dino growth.
It's cool to find what I was doing was well researched in big sections of the ocean - once I realized what it was that I was doing. :-)
The HNLC phenomena is still debated, but Fe or Fe+something are the overwhelmingly favored explanations. That lit helped me narrow my trace element search list.


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And by any chance, are you using OTC vitamin pills as a source for B12? I suggested this back on page 111...


...because dinos make their armor out of cellulose -- and as it turns out, cellulose is commonly used in vitamins and other pills to fill out the bulk of each pill when the active ingredient is present only in small quantities. I can't help but wonder if your second B12 run demonstrated proof of concept.
yep. OTC B12 supplements with various forms of cellulose and other fillers. I googled every ingredient because I wondered if I had Fe hiding in my B12, (nope) but I now looking back on the ingredient list, I did find Si in one of the fillers which seems possibly meaningful now. Wasn't thinking those lines at the time unfortunately, so I didn't examine that beaker under right power/light combo to track diatom growth. A revisit of B12+Si with added Fe is certainly worth a look.
B12 vitamin #1 (NatureMade)
1000mcg Cyanocobalamin
Dibasic Calcium Phosphate (CaHPO4)
Stearic Acid (C₁₇H₃₅CO₂H)
Cellulose Gel (C6H10O5)n
Magnesium Stearate Mg(C18H35O2)2
Croscarmellose Sodium - Na and a bunch more cellulose

B12 vitamin #2 (Sundown Naturals)
1500mcg Cyanocobalamin
Vegetable Cellulose
Vegetable stearic acid
Silica (!) - didn't catch that on first glance.
Vegetable Magnesium Stearate


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Are you using a chelated iron supplement? You might look into complexed iron (...chelation is technically a type of iron complex, I believe, but as I've said, chemistry is not my thing)
yes Iron EDTA. and I thought complexed and chealated were interchangeable. My Chem Kung-Fu is weak. I'll go back to chealators in a moment...


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I've read that scrubbers sometimes go through a dino phase before settling on green algae, which perhaps explains emerald crab's cautionary tale, and the phrase "oversized scrubber syndrome" was used by Floyd R Turbo on Santa Monica's web site to describe the tendency of scrubbers to grow dinos instead of green algae when their screens are too big
Another recurring theme. Nature may abhor a vacuum, but dinos sure love uncontested real estate.


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You might try adding a UV unit. If you knock back your ostis, maybe the amphidiniums that won't come out of the sand will pop up again.
I have a UV that I've been waiting on using, I'll start it after I get done with this line of experiments.

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AIO systems ... have teeny-tiny fuges, which means there isn't a lot of heft behind the algal holobiont. The tank:sump ratio looks way too high, if it isn't actually a divide by zero error.
Love the analogy. I wish I had a larger sump every day. I feel like I'd have so much more punch behind passive remediation options to create stability.


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Originally Posted by 34cygni
I'd bet good money that coralline is the canary in the coral mine signalling that the bacteria population in an aquarium is shifting away from the coral-friendly bunch that we want and towards dino-friendly types.
I can certainly cite the flip side.
Once dinos essentially vanished from my tank in the last 2-3 weeks, Coralline growth exploded - completely covering the back glass, alk has now dropped precipitously. The dino months prior showed only a trickle of Coralline growth in spite of abundant Ca/Alk levels throughout. It never got so bad as to have coralline turn white and die, as others have reported. There was no dosing that could be credited for the change.


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IRON RELEASE BY GFO STIMULATES DINOS?????????????????????????

Obnoxious CAPS and ????s were me making a note to myself, not part of Budman422's post.
When trying to limit Fe in my tank, after I ran across this info from RHF, I ripped my very exhausted (many months old) small amount of GFO out of my system....
Quote:
In other cases, the organic/iron complex can be absorbed and used, and in some of the most interesting cases, these ligands are specifically designed by organisms to “go out and collect iron” [siderophores].
...
For example, one research group recently claimed in the journal Nature that “Dissolved Fe(III) in the upper oceans occurs almost entirely in the form of complexes with strong org. ligands presumed to be of biol. origin.” 1

The chelators that bind iron in seawater (and by analogy, reef tank water) are many, and come from many sources that are present in our reef tanks. One researcher, for example, details the concern: “The present report shows that both inorganic Fe(III) in the presence of oxygen, and humic Fe(III) which stimulates lipid peroxydation, trigger or stimulate the release of chelators from green algae, red algae, and cyanobacteria.” 2 Consequently, we should anticipate that we have such chelators in our tanks.
...
“This review focuses on how cyanobacteria respond to growth-limiting levels of available iron and on how siderophores potentially alter the biological availability of iron in the system thereby allowing the cyanobacteria to exist at low iron availabilities.”
So yeah. It's possible that although GFO adds biologically unavailable forms of Fe, due to cyano, algae & co, it may not all stay that way.

Also this paper on Fe in seawater is unintentionally hilarious in that it's several dozen scientists basically throwing up their hands repeatedly at the complexity of trying to say what forms of Fe really constitutes "bioavailable" and who uses what, and how once in an organism it changes and is used by the rest of the system.
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...this task presently is largely beyond our capability. The perspective that developed during the workshop is that iron availability will be a function of: (1) the various chemical forms of iron in seawater, (2) the preference of the uptake mechanism of each organism for one or another of these forms, and (3) the balance between the reaction kinetics of iron
exchange among chemical species, the iron uptake kinetics of a given organism, and the iron demand of each member population within the phytoplankton assemblage. Clearly, the complexity of the natural seawater system frustrates attempts to define a general “biological availability” of iron...
..Moreover, our present ignorance of many aspects of iron chemistry in seawater makes it unlikely that we can accomplish this task within the near future.
Basically the whole paper is like that - interspersed with fascinating examples of organisms going to heroic lengths ("Fe-siderophore pirates" is an awesome phrase) to capture Fe that you wouldn't expect they could uptake. Granted, that was 20 years ago. But it still suggests that the notion that we could put bunches of GFO in our tanks and say it's totally unavailable biologically seems an unsupported premise.


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Old 04/12/2016, 10:44 AM   #3531
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Also, cyano needs to just chill. It's into every sketchy thing. It's like the organized crime family of the ocean. Any rare, valuable, desired resource - N, B12, Fe whatever - there's a cyanobacteria dealer on a corner somewhere selling his goods.
At this point it wouldn't surprise me to find out cyano has a hand in booze, drugs, and prostitution.
Actually it has been associated with vodka dosing so...


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Old 04/12/2016, 11:01 AM   #3532
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I can certainly cite the flip side.
Once dinos essentially vanished from my tank in the last 2-3 weeks, Coralline growth exploded - completely covering the back glass, alk has now dropped precipitously. The dino months prior showed only a trickle of Coralline growth in spite of abundant Ca/Alk levels throughout. It never got so bad as to have coralline turn white and die, as others have reported. There was no dosing that could be credited for the change.
Have any more details on this? My Alk suddenly dropped after caralline/diatoms showed up, and now some coraline is looking whiteish. is it dead?


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Old 04/12/2016, 11:26 AM   #3533
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Have any more details on this? My Alk suddenly dropped after caralline/diatoms showed up, and now some coraline is looking whiteish. is it dead?
Dose more... ASAP.


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Old 04/12/2016, 11:27 AM   #3534
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Also, cyano needs to just chill. It's into every sketchy thing. It's like the organized crime family of the ocean. Any rare, valuable, desired resource - N, B12, Fe whatever - there's a cyanobacteria dealer on a corner somewhere selling his goods.
At this point it wouldn't surprise me to find out cyano has a hand in booze, drugs, and prostitution.
Actually it has been associated with vodka dosing so...


And I agree.


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Old 04/12/2016, 11:31 AM   #3535
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Dose more... ASAP.
Yeah I started adjusting the doser more and more, by the way when I say dropped, it went down to 6.7 Kh from 7.5. Just wondering what else I should look out for/test?


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Old 04/12/2016, 11:33 AM   #3536
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Below 7 gets iffy...


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Old 04/12/2016, 01:36 PM   #3537
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I'd keep alkalinity above 7 dKH at the daily low. You could go lower, but it's definitely a tightrope walk.


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Old 04/13/2016, 05:51 AM   #3538
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Have any more details on this? My Alk suddenly dropped after caralline/diatoms showed up, and now some coraline is looking whiteish. is it dead?
Yeah, March 3 dKH tested at 8.2, (Ca 460) which is low for my tank. Usually 9+. So I added enough to push it to 9.
As dinos declined, coralline growth took off, covering my back glass which gets direct sun - didn't expect it to thrive under straight sunlight.
Few days ago a couple of corals closed, I realized coralline seemed to have slowed, tube worms and clams didn't have much bright white new growth at the end of their growth area, so I tested water again - 6.1 dKH. (420 Ca)
So I added baking soda. Spreading it over a few days, since I'm going 6 to 9.


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Old 04/13/2016, 06:01 AM   #3539
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Yeah, March 3 dKH tested at 8.2, (Ca 460) which is low for my tank. Usually 9+. So I added enough to push it to 9.
As dinos declined, coralline growth took off, covering my back glass which gets direct sun - didn't expect it to thrive under straight sunlight.
Few days ago a couple of corals closed, I realized coralline seemed to have slowed, tube worms and clams didn't have much bright white new growth at the end of their growth area, so I tested water again - 6.1 dKH. (420 Ca)
So I added baking soda. Spreading it over a few days, since I'm going 6 to 9.


Cool thanks. I tested mine this morning, 7.0. I aim for 7.5. Will ramp up dosing a little more.


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Old 04/13/2016, 10:48 AM   #3540
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Yeah, March 3 dKH tested at 8.2, (Ca 460) which is low for my tank. Usually 9+. So I added enough to push it to 9.
As dinos declined, coralline growth took off, covering my back glass which gets direct sun - didn't expect it to thrive under straight sunlight.
Few days ago a couple of corals closed, I realized coralline seemed to have slowed, tube worms and clams didn't have much bright white new growth at the end of their growth area, so I tested water again - 6.1 dKH. (420 Ca)
So I added baking soda. Spreading it over a few days, since I'm going 6 to 9.
I noticed you have multiple clams and like to point out that they are notorious for sucking the elements out at incredible rates.

I've had a derasa clam for around two years and it's still at the same size as when I got it.


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Old 04/13/2016, 10:51 AM   #3541
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I'd keep alkalinity above 7 dKH at the daily low. You could go lower, but it's definitely a tightrope walk.
Read my comments from January if you like to learn about going low with alkalinity.
Most of my SPS are dead and the ones remaining are in suspended animation.


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Old 04/14/2016, 04:39 AM   #3542
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heh. Been telling myself for a while I ought to actually read your whole megapost on p101. Lots of ideas I've toyed with came from searches that flagged small sections of the megapost.
I'm sure most hobbyists think I'm arrogant as hell for putting that up, but...


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08/16/2015, 10:04 PM #1543
34cygni

I'm willing to go out on a limb if it occasionally means I can find the leverage to push the hobby forward another inch or two.
Ultimately, my hope is that the sponge loop, along with the general propensity of sponges to consume labile DOC released by algae and the bacterioplankton that grow fat and happy on it, can stabilize a hobby system in a state where its microbiome is coral-dominant, and that when combined with a general effort to maintain sand bed biodiversity at the micro level across the entire system, this will keep dinos at bay even when N and P are zeroed out. Stable oligotrophy, like a real reef!

I was thinking that judicious use of GFO could keep P under control without stripping it out of the system, but I'm still quietly freaking out over DNA's observation...


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Originally Posted by taricha
So yeah. It's possible that although GFO adds biologically unavailable forms of Fe, due to cyano, algae & co, it may not all stay that way.
There's a category of anaerobic bacteria simply called "iron reducing bacteria" that require Fe+++ for their terminal electron receptor, meaning they process organic molecules by stripping off an electron to break a chemical bond and deposit the electron on an iron atom, changing its ionization state from Fe+++ to Fe++, and the electrons do work along the way to power the bacteria's metabolism. They're players. It even crossed my mind that the increased photosynthesis you saw in the B12 test could have been the dinos trying to obtain iron by releasing photosynthate to drive iron reducing bacteria, but it seems like they should've done better than they did if they were able to get hold of both B12 and iron, and in any case I had no idea if there was a source of iron in the sand.


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Originally Posted by taricha
Also this paper on Fe in seawater is unintentionally hilarious in that it's several dozen scientists basically throwing up their hands repeatedly at the complexity of trying to say what forms of Fe really constitutes "bioavailable" and who uses what, and how once in an organism it changes and is used by the rest of the system.
The irony of iron is that the reason it's in short supply and primary producers have tricks up their sleeves to get hold of it and to make use of different forms of it is that most of the Fe in NSW gets locked up by chelation, which involves iron reacting with organic molecules made by the primary producers themselves. D'oh! But for chelation, in oxygenated seawater iron would be about as readily available as manganese, IIRC.


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Originally Posted by taricha
funny you mention high nutrient low chlorophyll (HNLC) research. a couple of weeks ago, I realized how relevant HNLC was.
I was trying to point you in that direction, but given that HNLC popped when I was looking into B12 limitation, I should've known you'd already made the connection.


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Originally Posted by taricha
yep. OTC B12 supplements with various forms of cellulose and other fillers.
Shame you don't have your phyto tea or live sand on hand... I wonder if OTC B12 or even just plain cellulose would tip the battle against dinos.

The silica is unexpected -- since you mentioned not looking for diatoms, I'm guessing it was the Sundown Naturals that triggered the dino collapse... Did you use the NatureMade on the first run?


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Originally Posted by taricha
I wish I had a larger sump every day. I feel like I'd have so much more punch behind passive remediation options to create stability.
If you can't upgrade your sump, do you have the option of adding a display fuge? Display fuges are cool.


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Originally Posted by taricha
Also, cyano needs to just chill. It's into every sketchy thing. It's like the organized crime family of the ocean.
Cyano was the dominant marine primary producer for more than a billion years before the first true algae evolved, meaning it pretty much ran the oceans. Cyanobacteria were dinoflagellates before dinoflagellates were dinoflagellates, and cyano will be dinoflagellates again when dinoflagellates are acritarchs. Cyano abides.


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Old 04/15/2016, 06:01 AM   #3543
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Ultimately, my hope is that the sponge loop, along with the general propensity of sponges to consume labile DOC released by algae and the bacterioplankton that grow fat and happy on it, can stabilize a hobby system in a state where its microbiome is coral-dominant, and that when combined with a general effort to maintain sand bed biodiversity at the micro level across the entire system, this will keep dinos at bay even when N and P are zeroed out. Stable oligotrophy, like a real reef!
If you were to add a cryptic zone to the typical Display -> Algae Fuge / ATS -> Display. Where would you put it sequentially?


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Shame you don't have your phyto tea or live sand on hand... I wonder if OTC B12 or even just plain cellulose would tip the battle against dinos.
I still have my live sand, that I've pitched dinos into occasionally. What did you have in mind?

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The silica is unexpected -- since you mentioned not looking for diatoms, I'm guessing it was the Sundown Naturals that triggered the dino collapse... Did you use the NatureMade on the first run?
yes, nature made on first run. Sundown naturals on the 2nd.




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Cyanobacteria were dinoflagellates before dinoflagellates were dinoflagellates, and cyano will be dinoflagellates again when dinoflagellates are acritarchs. Cyano abides.
you got me. I lol'd.


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Old 04/16/2016, 04:05 PM   #3544
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If you were to add a cryptic zone to the typical Display -> Algae Fuge / ATS -> Display. Where would you put it sequentially?
In terms of trying to dino-proof a system by pushing its microbiome towards coral dominance, the purpose of sponges is to serve as a sink for algal DOC and to filter algae-friendly bacterioplankton out of the water, so that suggests they should be downstream of the algae. And since sponges poop coral chow, that suggests they should be upstream of the corals. So it looks to me like it should be:

display tank ---> macro/ATS ---> cryptic biofilter ---> display tank

But that Tank of the Month implements a cryptic sump with an unusual split flow, and there are hobby blogs and threads describing systems with intriguing sump layouts and Calfo-style RDSBs and cryptic fuges and whatever else that might work just as well. I'm sure there are reefers out there who've been capturing the benefits of the sponge loop for years without ever having heard of it because they're good hobbyists and good observers and they go with what makes their livestock happy.

So let a thousand flowers bloom -- I have no wish to be the arbiter of how to correctly set up a cryptic biofilter. This is the closest I've come to speaking to that point...


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Originally Posted by 34cygni
I've known for a while, now, that a coral reef is basically a vast algae scrubber sitting on top of an even bigger bacterial biofilter, and I've seen divers exploring reef caves on TV, but I had no idea there was a full-on cryptic zone underlying the entire reef structure! How cool is that?!? This suggests that the ideal setup for a hobby system would be a reef tank draining into a countercyclically lit display fuge with a Shimek-compliant DSB (...not necessarily in overall volume, but in terms of depth and the absence of counterindicated fauna so as to maintain benthic biodiversity -- at last, an excuse for the marine hobbyist to buy a hex tank!), which drains in turn into a large (ie, spanning the width of the stand for the two tanks above) cryptic sump with LR and a shallow sand bed where sponges consume labile DOC from the nutrient-limited macro and release POC for the corals.
...and in retrospect, I regret describing this as the "ideal setup". It might be my dreamquarium, no doubt in part because I've got a thirdhand 75 G acrylic hex standing empty, but it's only one possible implementation of the idea. Chalk it up to enthusiasm after discovering the sponge loop in the literature.

Sponges don't like microbubbles, BTW, and generally speaking, they do like Si. About 75% of sponge species have siliceous skeletons that don't readily dissolve and recycle if they die -- sponges can potentially live for centuries, perhaps thousands of years. Diatoms normally outcompete sponges for Si in the wild, but a "sponge scrubber" may give sponges enough of an unfair advantage to compete effectively. It would be interesting to try a cryptic biofilter in a system with a persistent diatom problem and see if the sponges can turn the tide.


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Originally Posted by taricha
I still have my live sand, that I've pitched dinos into occasionally. What did you have in mind?
Seeding toxic algae blooms with algicidal bacteria is an accepted biological control measure, so I'm back to thinking about green algae disliking dinos and wondering if an algae-dominant tank is a source of dinocidal bacteria that can be cultivated with cellulose... The simplest approach would be to take water and sand samples and dose NatureMade B12 heavily in hopes that the cellulose in the pills will trigger visible bacteria blooms that could be tested against ostis (...stearic acid turns out to be rather interesting -- have you looked into fatty acids at all? -- but it appears to be consumed in the synthesis of bacteria cell walls, so while I'm concerned that some unwanted, non-cellulolytic bacteria will come along and eat it, maybe it's a good thing to have in the mix). Note that you may have to oxygenate if you get a bacteria bloom, as bacterial respiration will draw down dissolved oxygen and might crash the culture.

Another approach would be to dose your live sand tank with OTC B12 every day for a week, and every day take a sample of sand and put it in a beaker with osti-infested sand. A shift from the healthy live sand being taken over by ostis to live sand killing ostis might indicate the presence of dinocidal bacteria -- or it might indicate that your ciliates are all pumped up on B12 and ready for a fight. You might be able to tell the difference by looking for an increase in the ciliate population, as presumably the smaller the bump in ciliate numbers, the more dinos fell to bacteria, instead.

But maybe I'm fixated on green algae for no good reason. If the silica in Sundown Naturals B12 really did trigger the growth of diatoms, it's pretty impressive that they managed to rise up and defeat the ostis without any outside help. Dinos eat diatoms, and diatoms are presumably not okay with this, so they're probably friends with dinocidal bacteria, too. Maybe that's where to look for help -- after all, diatoms evolved after dinos, meaning they had to beat dinos so they could take their place in the sun. In the end, green algae lost that fight.


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Originally Posted by taricha
you got me. I lol'd.
You're very kind to say so.


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Old 04/18/2016, 08:54 AM   #3545
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I like the idea of finding biological allies. I think that's at the heart of what we're doing already.

Understanding what makes them allies and then experimentally proving how and why they behave is the tricky part.


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Old 04/22/2016, 12:13 AM   #3546
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Runing zeovit from day 1 with the thought that ULNS would help curd the unwanted algae and beautiful garden of SPS, After getting rid of the algae infestation a month ago, with 3 dose of Coral snow but immediately followed that was something I can't id + really bad case of dino. I have completely stop the dosing of zeostart and sponge power 2 days ago as I feel that the dino were prqbably consuming that to grow even faster. I am still maintaining the zeo reactor at 100gal/hr rate, add combination of 4mL of coral snow and 4 drops of zeobak after dark.
What should I do now, take zeovit reactor (vibe) off line since the mule released may even fuel the dino more? what do you guys think, I've read that zeozym + biomat might help, if so I should administer with zeobak and coral snow, please help!!!!! Really want to get rid of this ugliness.





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Old 04/22/2016, 09:42 AM   #3547
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Oh wow. How old is the setup? If it's new, I'd just drain and start over with new live rock and sand.


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Old 04/22/2016, 09:45 AM   #3548
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Took a sample of water with the slimy stuff, and took a video for everyone to enjoy, I can now confirm that they are indeed dino, the question now is how to kill these little buggers. I subsequently diluted the sample with half of RO/DI and the pests are gone, but I can't just dump my rocks with various frags of SPS for water bath can I ?






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Old 04/22/2016, 11:29 AM   #3549
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If it's early enough in this tank's life, I'd start over. You need new life.

Get new live rock and sand and start over with a normal bacteria and algae cycle. Be happy when you see the diatom bloom and the hair algae... Then slowly tune it down to normal.

Your images show the worst case I've ever seen.


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Old 04/22/2016, 12:03 PM   #3550
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Its about 3 months old, and started with dead rock, should I go bare bottom.

Can you kindly suggest live rock source I like something porus, thanks.


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