Reef Central Online Community

Home Forum Here you can view your subscribed threads, work with private messages and edit your profile and preferences View New Posts View Today's Posts

Find other members Frequently Asked Questions Search Reefkeeping ...an online magazine for marine aquarists Support our sponsors and mention Reef Central

Go Back   Reef Central Online Community > General Interest Forums > The Reef Chemistry Forum
Register Blogs FAQ Calendar Mark Forums Read

Notices

Reply
Thread Tools
Old 04/14/2015, 03:06 PM   #951
elFloyd
Registered Member
 
elFloyd's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: Cumming, GA
Posts: 387
Hi DNA...

I am in my 8th day of H2O2 dosing (60ml per day: 180 gallon tank).
I have a haze in my tank; run a big skimmer; and change filter socks daily.
Calcium is at 450. No calcium reactor, or supplements.

Regarding coccolithopores... how can these be controlled and diminished?


elFloyd is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 04/14/2015, 03:41 PM   #952
Montireef
Registered Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Posts: 331
That haze might be a bacterial bloom.
Have you tried a germicide?


Montireef is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04/14/2015, 03:51 PM   #953
elFloyd
Registered Member
 
elFloyd's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: Cumming, GA
Posts: 387
Quote:
Originally Posted by Montireef View Post
That haze might be a bacterial bloom.
Have you tried a germicide?
No germicide... currently dosing H2O2... don't want to get a cocktail going with too many things at once.


elFloyd is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 04/14/2015, 05:00 PM   #954
bertoni
RC Mod
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: Mountain View, CA, USA
Posts: 85,535
If the tank is having a bacterial bloom, I'd consider adding a UV filter, although I'm not sure I'd buy one just yet. Borrowing one might be useful, though.


__________________
Jonathan Bertoni
bertoni is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 04/14/2015, 05:02 PM   #955
elFloyd
Registered Member
 
elFloyd's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: Cumming, GA
Posts: 387
Quote:
Originally Posted by bertoni View Post
If the tank is having a bacterial bloom, I'd consider adding a UV filter, although I'm not sure I'd buy one just yet. Borrowing one might be useful, though.
UV sterilizer is in use.


elFloyd is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 04/14/2015, 06:02 PM   #956
bertoni
RC Mod
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: Mountain View, CA, USA
Posts: 85,535
If the sterilizer is working properly, it likely will be able to kill the bloom fairly quickly, although the skimmer might need some time to clear up the water. If the bulb is too small or too old or the flow is too low, that could be an issue, though.


__________________
Jonathan Bertoni
bertoni is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 04/15/2015, 12:02 AM   #957
Montireef
Registered Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Posts: 331
Any news with the Kordon Itch Attack trials? I had some success time ago and I'd like to know if other people are.


Montireef is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04/15/2015, 11:31 AM   #958
DNA
Registered Member
 
DNA's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2001
Location: Iceland
Posts: 1,511
We don't have any of the bottled plankton here so I can't try that on my tank.
Is it something that works in any good permanent way?

---

It's been a long time since I looked this good at my water column as I did last night.
I compared the mass from right after the lights had gone out to 4 hours later.

There was a steady increase and after 4 hours it was much more dense than I thought it would be. (~5x)
I saw loads of brown "dino" colored quite large 1/24" (1mm) clumps floating around.
A cloud or haze can be seen in the strong beam from the flashlight that seems to be a part of my reef tanks night life.

A lot is going on in the tanks microscopic world.
Most of it has to be living plankton looking for food.

I have a vast number of species in this size category already, but amphipods I only see rarely as dead skeletons.
I used to see them frequently in my pre-dino years of reefing.


DNA is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04/15/2015, 02:36 PM   #959
cal_stir
Registered Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: corunna,ontario,canada
Posts: 263
I dosed ich attack for 5 days with my simmer and carbon off, it has slowed it down, now green algae is growing on the glass and cyano is starting to bloom which I think might be a good sign, I will try to put some under the microscope tonight.


cal_stir is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 04/18/2015, 06:11 AM   #960
DNA
Registered Member
 
DNA's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2001
Location: Iceland
Posts: 1,511
A survey on dinoflagellates in reef tanks.

A survey on dinoflagellates in reef tanks.

I wanted to do it years ago, but since we have not yet got to the essence of dinoflagellates I think it's the best step in moving forward with this mistery.
The aim is for us to easily be able to compare our tanks and parameters in order to pick out what we have in common and hopefully what it is that makes dinos tick.

It will be very extensive and next to everything about your tank will be included.
Finishing it should take less than 10 minutes.

Send me a private message here on RC.
Once I have 5 willing to take part it's on.
Everyone with a dinoflagellate problem can take part.

It will be categorized into the types of dinos you have.
Reefers with unidentified dinos can also participate. (Identification is very important, so do it first if you possibly can).

A spreadsheet format is what I have in mind.
I'd send it to you via email and once you have filled it in and sent it back you'll receive everyone else's contribution.

Updates will be emailed to everyone when new info gets added.

-----


DNA is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04/18/2015, 07:07 AM   #961
Montireef
Registered Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Posts: 331
Great idea. I'm in with ostreopsis.


Montireef is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04/18/2015, 08:08 AM   #962
Amphiprion
Premium Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Mobile, AL
Posts: 6,691
Quote:
Originally Posted by cal_stir View Post
I dosed ich attack for 5 days with my simmer and carbon off, it has slowed it down, now green algae is growing on the glass and cyano is starting to bloom which I think might be a good sign, I will try to put some under the microscope tonight.
Encourage these for as long as you can. I haven't seen any signs of dinoflagellates for well over a month now. I never got the chance to try ich attack, but I kept the skimmer off and fed generously to encourage as much algae as reasonably possible. Plenty of cyano and macroalgal growth ensued. I've even been able to do several 40% water changes (as an experiment) since to no detriment. I did run my skimmer for a couple of weeks afterward (no dino appeared) and all that did was kill off some of my tunicates, so I've left it off.


__________________
You've done it now, haven't you?

Current Tank Info: 40g breeder patch reef w/ seagrass; 2-250w XM 10K; Vortech MP40wES & MP10wES; BM Curve 7 skimmer; carbon & occasional GFO
Amphiprion is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04/18/2015, 11:36 AM   #963
Royce7586
Registered Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2014
Posts: 99
Quote:
Originally Posted by cal_stir View Post
I dosed ich attack for 5 days with my simmer and carbon off, it has slowed it down, now green algae is growing on the glass and cyano is starting to bloom which I think might be a good sign, I will try to put some under the microscope tonight.
ya for me the ich attack didn't kill them just seemed to slow growth drastically, Keep siphoning them out and you should beat it if it works the same as it did for me. I did get cyano and green algae I am now working on getting rid of the cyano, my foxface eats every speck of green algae :P but dinos still seem to be gone


Royce7586 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04/20/2015, 10:34 AM   #964
dcarwile
Registered Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2014
Posts: 6
Been following this thread for a long time. I'm also in with ostreopsis ID'd. I have them undercontrol with NoPox, but am still interested in a cure/permanent solution. DNA, forums won't let me PM you because I don't have enough posts lol.


dcarwile is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04/20/2015, 10:44 AM   #965
Montireef
Registered Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Posts: 331
NOPOX???

If I put a single drop I get a dino bloom!


Montireef is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04/20/2015, 12:14 PM   #966
yeldarbj
Registered Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Tulsa, OK
Posts: 1,325
Quote:
Originally Posted by dcarwile View Post
Been following this thread for a long time. I'm also in with ostreopsis ID'd. I have them undercontrol with NoPox, but am still interested in a cure/permanent solution. DNA, forums won't let me PM you because I don't have enough posts lol.
If you want a permanent solution, then I'd suggest nutrients, nutrients, nutrients. I've been skimmerless for 10 months now and dino free (ostreospsis) for 8 months. I run a small home made algae turf scrubber for filtration and have a full sps tank. Algae is your friend and the dino's enemy.


yeldarbj is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04/20/2015, 12:44 PM   #967
dcarwile
Registered Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2014
Posts: 6
Yea monti. I put in max dosage of nopox and dinos are gone, as soon as i stop they come back. I can test it like clockwork. Vitamin C dosing was my most recent attempt to get off the nopox. I attempted an Algal Turf Scrubber and it go covered in dino instead of turf algae lol. I tried the growing skimmate bacteria and dosing skimmate as mentioned earlier here. I have not tried the lab cultured parasite one of you mentioned. I've tried everything in this thread except the Kordon and UV, lol. I have a mixed reef. NoPox ****es off my softies and acans at this dosage(no nutrients), but my SPS thrive. Can't find a happy medium where everything is happy and dino doesn't show. Can't permanently eradicate it and don't want to tear down the tank for something that is manageable just annoying. I can give a lot more details of everything I've dosed and done to my tank over the last couple years.


dcarwile is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04/20/2015, 02:11 PM   #968
Montireef
Registered Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Posts: 331
Quote:
Originally Posted by yeldarbj View Post
If you want a permanent solution, then I'd suggest nutrients, nutrients, nutrients. I've been skimmerless for 10 months now and dino free (ostreospsis) for 8 months. I run a small home made algae turf scrubber for filtration and have a full sps tank. Algae is your friend and the dino's enemy.
I agree, if I switch on my skimmer I get a dino bloom a few days later.
Now I am dosing KNO3 and everything looks better. I have no algae anyway, not even the smallest one, they just don't thrive although my big tank (600 gal) sits in the sun (it is outside the house).


Montireef is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04/20/2015, 02:12 PM   #969
yeldarbj
Registered Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Tulsa, OK
Posts: 1,325
I understand how that can happen - the dinos growing on the screen instead of algae. That's exactly what happened to my macro algae. Did you have enough nutrients to grow algae. It took my tank at least a month after removing the skimmer to build up some nutrients, and I was feeding often and heavy to increase phosphates. I also slowly dosed the other basic ingredients of fertilizer - nitrate, potassium, iron, silicates, iodide. My goal was to grow whatever I could - algae, cyano, diatoms. Eventually my screen grew algae and dinos started to diminish.


yeldarbj is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04/20/2015, 02:34 PM   #970
Adrnalnrsh
Registered Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Posts: 205
Quote:
Originally Posted by Montireef View Post
NOPOX???

If I put a single drop I get a dino bloom!

Funny, I got dino's after switching to Nopox


Adrnalnrsh is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04/20/2015, 02:45 PM   #971
DNA
Registered Member
 
DNA's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2001
Location: Iceland
Posts: 1,511
My tank has had bloomin dinos without any macro algae in my tank.
I have now a huge ball of Cheatomorhpa in my sump and I prune it down by about a basket ball weekly.
I have let it go to biblical proportions without having any effect on my dinos.


DNA is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04/20/2015, 02:51 PM   #972
DNA
Registered Member
 
DNA's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2001
Location: Iceland
Posts: 1,511
There was an environmental accident recently somewhere with massive amounts of iron.
At first it caused an algae bloom of some sorts with increased iron and then it killed it off.

Iron is known for tinting nature red or brown.
I wonder if it plays a part in our dinos fancy brown color.


DNA is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04/20/2015, 03:15 PM   #973
yeldarbj
Registered Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Tulsa, OK
Posts: 1,325
Quote:
Originally Posted by DNA View Post
My tank has had bloomin dinos without any macro algae in my tank.
I have now a huge ball of Cheatomorhpa in my sump and I prune it down by about a basket ball weekly.
I have let it go to biblical proportions without having any effect on my dinos.
I think some sort of "micro" algae or turf like algae is the key. I had to remove my cheato for a while because it just ended up as another host for the dinos.

I'd speculate that it's not the algae itself, but the organisms that survive on the algae that helps to clear out the dinos.


yeldarbj is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04/20/2015, 03:30 PM   #974
dcarwile
Registered Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2014
Posts: 6
Yea Chaeto won't grow. I never gave the turf scrubber that much time so i'm not sure. I just saw it as another place to grow dinos and gave up on it honestly. I had hair algae, doses an algaecide (whoops!), then got cyano so I dosed chemiclean, then hello Dino. Since then i've been dealing with dino. Occasionally, I can get cyano to grow a few days then dino consumes it. So far my only answer has been to overdose nopox(i dose for max nutrient load instead of the recommend ml because i know you can't read tests kits when you have algae or bacteria consuming it immediately). Haven't read nitrate or phosphate on my red sea or api test kits since i got cyano. I think NoPox just act similar to the guys dosing beneficial bacteria - outcompetes. Thinking about removing my substrate completely and giving the ATS another go. For clarity, i still skimmed when i tried the ATS previously.


dcarwile is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04/22/2015, 01:41 AM   #975
Montireef
Registered Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Posts: 331
After 6 months dealing with ostreopsis and amphidinium, here are my findings:

- Some dinos are almost always in our tanks, they just don't thrive (amphidinum). Others are caught.
- They can be easily triggered by a drop in PO4, specially when rapid.
- The best way to deal and get rid of them is competition. Foster other forms of life, specially algae that needs some PO4 to thrive. If you are lucky you can get other kind of dinoflagellates like oxyhrris marina and beat them very fast.
- Some kind of them form cysts and therefore are really difficult to get rid of. They can disappear for months and suddenly show up again if conditions are favorable.
- Stong flows help them spread and make the problem worse.
- Nutrient depletion slow them down but won't help on the long run. It is better to foul the water slowly increasing feedings and stopping waterchanges, this is food for dinos, but also for competitors that eventually will suffocate them.

As an example of this I am succesfully getting rid of ostreopsis by dosing large amounts of phytoplankton. No algae at all and water is pristine; NO3 and PO4 are still undetectable but high enough to permit other forms of life like copepods, worms, amphipods...


Montireef is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -6. The time now is 10:36 PM.


TapaTalk Enabled

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Powered by Searchlight © 2017 Axivo Inc.
Use of this web site is subject to the terms and conditions described in the user agreement.
Reef CentralTM Reef Central, LLC. Copyright 1999-2014