What is the Best Liquid Phosphate Remover out there? Brightwell Aquatics Phosphat-E?

that Fish Guy · 08/17/2013, 10:08 PM

What is the Best Liquid Phosphate Remover out there?

My LFS highly recommends Brightwell Aquatics Phosphat-E

http://www.marinedepot.com/Brightwel...ADSAPR-vi.html

Before I get some I just wanted to make sure that there was not something better out there that they do not carry at my LFS.

NCSUsalt · 08/17/2013, 11:52 PM

they are all basically the same, lanthanum chloride

pkane11384 · 08/18/2013, 09:40 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by NCSUsalt

they are all basically the same, lanthanum chloride

I'm with NCSUsalt. I've dosed with Lanthanum Chloride on rock that i've been cooking but I wouldn't put anything like that in my tank. I've used Brightwell's Reef Biofuel but I think the best way is a reactor of some sort with PhosBan. I didn't notice the decline in my GHA until I started using it. Theres a link to the Biofuel if you want to check it out

http://www.drsfostersmith.com/produc...m?pcatid=23652

Alberta-newb · 08/18/2013, 09:50 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by NCSUsalt

they are all basically the same, lanthanum chloride

Agreed, I use ATM's "Agent Green" as its the only one available locally. Wish I started with lanthanum chloride years ago! I use it in my DTs regularly with no ill effects on fish and coral. Has worked very well on nuisance algae and no more bio-pellets for me.

that Fish Guy · 08/18/2013, 07:03 PM

My Friend e-mailed me this.

Is this true?

No........ Don't use liquid phosphate removers. They deplete the O2 level in the tank. These may be the most dangerous products on the market.

If these products are simply dosed to the tank, the phosphate will precipitates out. Then later on it can break down and enter the water again. These products should not be called phosphate removers, because they don't remove phosphate. They simply bind it for a time.

To use these products efficiently, you'd need to set up a very slow flow filter sock, with a micron rating of about 5. The product can then be VERY slowly dosed to the sock. As the phosphate precipitates out, it gets caught in the sock. When the sock is removed the phosphate is also removed.

There are much easier, and safer was of dealing with phosphate without dumping harmful chemicals into the tank.

that Fish Guy · 08/18/2013, 07:05 PM

I have not heard of this before.

I have only heard good things about this product including 12 Positive Reviews on Marine Depot where it got a 4.0/5.0

The only negative complaints were about it lowering PH not Oxygen.

But then again Nobody told me about Oxygen loss with Chemi-Clean and I lost 75% of my Livestock after the first day so I know what can happen when you have low Oxygen.

Does anybody else know about Brightwell Phosphat-E Liquid Phosphate Remover lowering Oxygen after using it?

marinelife · 08/18/2013, 07:40 PM

http://coralmagazine-us.com/content/foiling-phosphate

crn005 · 08/18/2013, 08:29 PM

As far as the liquid removers versus the phosban, it depends on your situation. If you have an uncontrollable problem then use the liquids. LaCl is awesome at precipitating out phosphates. If you're using a lot of mechanical filtration then you won't get as much precipitation on the rocks and what not as you would think. Just make sure you are dosing near a skimmer or filter sock. As far as the phosban, that's more of a maintenance thing IMO. I think there are more affordable and effecient methods than phosban (algae turf scrubbers, macros, etc.) but they have their place in certain situations.

As far as the oxygen, correct if I'm wrong, but doesn't the exchange between the La, PO4, and Cl have nothing to do with oxygen? That's my understanding atleast but I majored in psychology and philosophy. Our wheel house sings a different tune than most chemists.

that Fish Guy · 08/18/2013, 09:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by crn005

As far as the liquid removers versus the phosban, it depends on your situation. If you have an uncontrollable problem then use the liquids. LaCl is awesome at precipitating out phosphates. If you're using a lot of mechanical filtration then you won't get as much precipitation on the rocks and what not as you would think. Just make sure you are dosing near a skimmer or filter sock. As far as the phosban, that's more of a maintenance thing IMO. I think there are more affordable and effecient methods than phosban (algae turf scrubbers, macros, etc.) but they have their place in certain situations.

As far as the oxygen, correct if I'm wrong, but doesn't the exchange between the La, PO4, and Cl have nothing to do with oxygen? That's my understanding atleast but I majored in psychology and philosophy. Our wheel house sings a different tune than most chemists.

Why does the bottle say to put it into your Protein Skimmer?

Usually when you add Chemicals into the Aquarium the Directions always say to turn off Protein Skimmers, Filters, UV Sterilizers, etc. because they will stop the Chemical from Working Properly.

NCSUsalt · 08/18/2013, 09:40 PM

In my experience I've always dosed lanthanum with a drip into a sock and also made sure that the water coming from the sock was going directly into a protein skimmer intake. You definitely do not want the precipitate in your water, and it is best to remove it. There is a great thread in the DIY section on a LaCl reactor setup

dkeller_nc · 08/19/2013, 07:40 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by that Fish Guy

Why does the bottle say to put it into your Protein Skimmer?

Usually when you add Chemicals into the Aquarium the Directions always say to turn off Protein Skimmers, Filters, UV Sterilizers, etc. because they will stop the Chemical from Working Properly.

Because lanthanum chloride forms an insoluble precipitate in the presence of phosphate (lanthanum phosphate). You want some sort of mechanical filtration to remove the precipitate, which can be a protein skimmer, a filter sock, or the filtration in a dedicated lanthanum chloride reactor.

Dosing lanthanum chloride will have no effect on the oxygen content of the tank water, but there is some antectdotal suspicion that tangs of the zebrasoma genus are sensitive to lanthanum. Whether this turns out to be true will take scientific study. In the meantime, I personally wouldn't use lanthanum in a tank with zebrasoma tangs - water changes and GFO would be a safer, proven alternative.

Dave & Monica · 08/19/2013, 12:46 PM

See long thread here: http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/sh...hanum+chloride

that Fish Guy · 08/23/2013, 10:09 AM

Somebody told me that it binds the Calcium and makes it unusable to Corals hence killing them.

He said you will have 400+ Readings when Testing for Calcium but essentially it might as well be Zero since the Corals cannot use the Calcium.

I do not know how True that is but it is Very Very Scary.

Has anybody else heard of this?

carlosdeandrade · 11/21/2013, 08:53 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by that Fish Guy

Somebody told me that it binds the Calcium and makes it unusable to Corals hence killing them.

He said you will have 400+ Readings when Testing for Calcium but essentially it might as well be Zero since the Corals cannot use the Calcium.

I do not know how True that is but it is Very Very Scary.

Has anybody else heard of this?

That's interesting, Why would a company as reputable as Brightwell's sell a product that, if used correctly, harm your tank. It just goes beyond my logical way of thinking, IMHO and no offence.

zaitmi · 12/27/2013, 05:51 AM

20 gallon cube with hangon remora.

I have used brightwell Phosphate-E and 1st time(6 weeks back) my bubble corals closed and 2ndtime(last week) my green star polyp closed. Now i am also seeing some green hair algae on my sandbed and rocks. I replace water fortnightly but i think i will do it weekly for next 2 times to remove excess if any phosphate-E.

kga943 · 12/27/2013, 09:07 AM

my lfs recommends red sea no3 po4-x biological nitrate and phosphate reducer
http://www.drsfostersmith.com/produc...m?pcatid=24344
working ok for me, no more phosban but you need to keep up on water changes

jninternational · 07/10/2016, 09:33 AM

Few weeks ago, I had hair algae bloom. It took several weeks to kill and clean the tank. I used DinoX to kill the algae and had a problem of dead algae on corals. I cleaned corals with Dip and gentle brushing.
Agent green wonderful product. When I had 17 ppm of Phosphate, the agent green brought it down to 0 ppm in one day. I did not use too much. 20 ml for 220 gal aquarium. Today, Phosphate is 0.7 ppm. I used 1/2 of agent green. Phosphate dropped to 0 ppm. I have lot of fish and corals in the tank. By-the-way, I have phosphate reactor and NP bio pellets reactors running. All together, Lanthanum chloride, Iron Oxide and Bio pellets taking care of my tank from Phosphate. The video is very useful to understand the mechanism of the chemical. One more thing, I checked Calcium levels in the tank. I always Ca level above 450 ppm. After seeing this video, I checked Ca level, it drops 10 to 20 ppm. If my Ca level drops below 420 ppm. I dose ME CORAL liquid Ca. Me Coral products are quality products that I can trust.

08/17/2013, 10:08 PM	#1
that Fish Guy Frag Swap Crusader! Join Date: Apr 2011 Posts: 2,538	What is the Best Liquid Phosphate Remover out there? Brightwell Aquatics Phosphat-E? What is the Best Liquid Phosphate Remover out there? My LFS highly recommends Brightwell Aquatics Phosphat-E http://www.marinedepot.com/Brightwel...ADSAPR-vi.html Before I get some I just wanted to make sure that there was not something better out there that they do not carry at my LFS. __________________ For a Complete List of all the Frag Swaps in 2018 Click the Link Below. http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=2655153 You do not want to miss any! Current Tank Info: 55 Gallon, 45 Gallon, 29 Gallon, 20 Gallon, 20 Gallon #2, 10 Gallon

08/18/2013, 07:03 PM	#5
that Fish Guy Frag Swap Crusader! Join Date: Apr 2011 Posts: 2,538	My Friend e-mailed me this. Is this true? No........ Don't use liquid phosphate removers. They deplete the O2 level in the tank. These may be the most dangerous products on the market. If these products are simply dosed to the tank, the phosphate will precipitates out. Then later on it can break down and enter the water again. These products should not be called phosphate removers, because they don't remove phosphate. They simply bind it for a time. To use these products efficiently, you'd need to set up a very slow flow filter sock, with a micron rating of about 5. The product can then be VERY slowly dosed to the sock. As the phosphate precipitates out, it gets caught in the sock. When the sock is removed the phosphate is also removed. There are much easier, and safer was of dealing with phosphate without dumping harmful chemicals into the tank. __________________ For a Complete List of all the Frag Swaps in 2018 Click the Link Below. http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=2655153 You do not want to miss any! Current Tank Info: 55 Gallon, 45 Gallon, 29 Gallon, 20 Gallon, 20 Gallon #2, 10 Gallon

08/18/2013, 07:05 PM	#6
that Fish Guy Frag Swap Crusader! Join Date: Apr 2011 Posts: 2,538	I have not heard of this before. I have only heard good things about this product including 12 Positive Reviews on Marine Depot where it got a 4.0/5.0 The only negative complaints were about it lowering PH not Oxygen. But then again Nobody told me about Oxygen loss with Chemi-Clean and I lost 75% of my Livestock after the first day so I know what can happen when you have low Oxygen. Does anybody else know about Brightwell Phosphat-E Liquid Phosphate Remover lowering Oxygen after using it? __________________ For a Complete List of all the Frag Swaps in 2018 Click the Link Below. http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=2655153 You do not want to miss any! Current Tank Info: 55 Gallon, 45 Gallon, 29 Gallon, 20 Gallon, 20 Gallon #2, 10 Gallon

08/18/2013, 07:40 PM	#7
marinelife Registered Member Join Date: May 2000 Location: Union, Ohio, USA Posts: 6,589	http://coralmagazine-us.com/content/foiling-phosphate __________________ I'm a SaltGeek are You? All LED since 2010. Current Tank Info: 375 Gallon Reef with siporax, all LED lighting, and Red Dragon 3 and Abyzz A200 on 2 closed loops.

08/23/2013, 10:09 AM	#13
that Fish Guy Frag Swap Crusader! Join Date: Apr 2011 Posts: 2,538	Somebody told me that it binds the Calcium and makes it unusable to Corals hence killing them. He said you will have 400+ Readings when Testing for Calcium but essentially it might as well be Zero since the Corals cannot use the Calcium. I do not know how True that is but it is Very Very Scary. Has anybody else heard of this? __________________ For a Complete List of all the Frag Swaps in 2018 Click the Link Below. http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=2655153 You do not want to miss any! Current Tank Info: 55 Gallon, 45 Gallon, 29 Gallon, 20 Gallon, 20 Gallon #2, 10 Gallon

08/17/2013, 11:52 PM	#2
NCSUsalt Registered Member Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: raleigh, NC Posts: 619	they are all basically the same, lanthanum chloride

08/18/2013, 08:29 PM	#8
crn005 Registered Member Join Date: May 2012 Location: Spring, TX Posts: 744	As far as the liquid removers versus the phosban, it depends on your situation. If you have an uncontrollable problem then use the liquids. LaCl is awesome at precipitating out phosphates. If you're using a lot of mechanical filtration then you won't get as much precipitation on the rocks and what not as you would think. Just make sure you are dosing near a skimmer or filter sock. As far as the phosban, that's more of a maintenance thing IMO. I think there are more affordable and effecient methods than phosban (algae turf scrubbers, macros, etc.) but they have their place in certain situations. As far as the oxygen, correct if I'm wrong, but doesn't the exchange between the La, PO4, and Cl have nothing to do with oxygen? That's my understanding atleast but I majored in psychology and philosophy. Our wheel house sings a different tune than most chemists.

08/18/2013, 09:40 PM	#10
NCSUsalt Registered Member Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: raleigh, NC Posts: 619	In my experience I've always dosed lanthanum with a drip into a sock and also made sure that the water coming from the sock was going directly into a protein skimmer intake. You definitely do not want the precipitate in your water, and it is best to remove it. There is a great thread in the DIY section on a LaCl reactor setup

08/19/2013, 12:46 PM	#12
Dave & Monica Registered Member Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: Aurora, CO Posts: 1,255	See long thread here: http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/sh...hanum+chloride

12/27/2013, 05:51 AM	#15
zaitmi Registered Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Kolkata, India Posts: 433	20 gallon cube with hangon remora. I have used brightwell Phosphate-E and 1st time(6 weeks back) my bubble corals closed and 2ndtime(last week) my green star polyp closed. Now i am also seeing some green hair algae on my sandbed and rocks. I replace water fortnightly but i think i will do it weekly for next 2 times to remove excess if any phosphate-E. __________________ Current Tank Info : 10 Gallon Sumpless Tank, 3 "Live Sand Light kessil a80 Live Stock Info : 1 tomato clown

12/27/2013, 09:07 AM	#16
kga943 Registered Member Join Date: Apr 2011 Posts: 504	my lfs recommends red sea no3 po4-x biological nitrate and phosphate reducer http://www.drsfostersmith.com/produc...m?pcatid=24344 working ok for me, no more phosban but you need to keep up on water changes

07/10/2016, 09:33 AM	#17
jninternational Registered Member Join Date: Jan 2016 Posts: 11	Few weeks ago, I had hair algae bloom. It took several weeks to kill and clean the tank. I used DinoX to kill the algae and had a problem of dead algae on corals. I cleaned corals with Dip and gentle brushing. Agent green wonderful product. When I had 17 ppm of Phosphate, the agent green brought it down to 0 ppm in one day. I did not use too much. 20 ml for 220 gal aquarium. Today, Phosphate is 0.7 ppm. I used 1/2 of agent green. Phosphate dropped to 0 ppm. I have lot of fish and corals in the tank. By-the-way, I have phosphate reactor and NP bio pellets reactors running. All together, Lanthanum chloride, Iron Oxide and Bio pellets taking care of my tank from Phosphate. The video is very useful to understand the mechanism of the chemical. One more thing, I checked Calcium levels in the tank. I always Ca level above 450 ppm. After seeing this video, I checked Ca level, it drops 10 to 20 ppm. If my Ca level drops below 420 ppm. I dose ME CORAL liquid Ca. Me Coral products are quality products that I can trust.