Reef Central Online Community

Home Forum Here you can view your subscribed threads, work with private messages and edit your profile and preferences View New Posts View Today's Posts

Find other members Frequently Asked Questions Search Reefkeeping ...an online magazine for marine aquarists Support our sponsors and mention Reef Central

Go Back   Reef Central Online Community > Invert and Plant Forums > Marine Plants & Macroalgae
Register Blogs FAQ Calendar Mark Forums Read

Notices

Reply
Thread Tools
Old 10/17/2017, 05:50 PM   #2776
sam.basye
Registered Member
 
sam.basye's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2014
Location: Lynchburg, VA
Posts: 1,097
You sure it's not something fishy going on with the QT?
Sure seems like you haven't been having much luck with anything you've put in there.


__________________
><`SAM`;{°<

Current Tank Info: 26 gal Bowfront foam wall build: http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=2457621
Foam Wall Instructable: http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php
sam.basye is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10/17/2017, 06:01 PM   #2777
Michael Hoaster
Registered Member
 
Michael Hoaster's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Boulder, CO
Posts: 2,755
Both groups of chromis displayed the same symptoms, so I'm pretty sure it was uromena. There were two mollies in there with them, and they're still doing fine.

But yes, there has been something fishy going on, and that's my slackness with quarantine in general. Hopefully, I've learned my lesson this time!

The best defense against disease is to never get it. In decades of fish keeping, my success rate at curing sick fish is 0%.


__________________
As many naturalists and environmentalists have suggested, we should set aside our arrogance,
our desire to conquer and control everything, and walk hand in hand with Mother Nature. -Walter Adey

Current Tank Info: 180g Seagrass-Mangrove Mudbank Lagoon
Michael Hoaster is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10/17/2017, 09:44 PM   #2778
Michael Hoaster
Registered Member
 
Michael Hoaster's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Boulder, CO
Posts: 2,755
So, after all that depressing news, I have some good news.

My seagrasses are pearling! For those not acquainted with the term, pearling is when an aquatic plant produces little bubbles that look like tiny pearls. The bubbles are oxygen. When this happens it means that the plant is photosynthesizing well and growing. It also means that my tank water is super saturated with oxygen, so no more can dissolve into the water, so it bubbles out. This commonly happens in fresh water planted tanks, but it's the first time I've seen it in my marine planted tank. So yay!

Hopefully, this means I've got some new growth coming up…


__________________
As many naturalists and environmentalists have suggested, we should set aside our arrogance,
our desire to conquer and control everything, and walk hand in hand with Mother Nature. -Walter Adey

Current Tank Info: 180g Seagrass-Mangrove Mudbank Lagoon
Michael Hoaster is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10/17/2017, 10:18 PM   #2779
sam.basye
Registered Member
 
sam.basye's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2014
Location: Lynchburg, VA
Posts: 1,097
Exciting! Hopefully they really start multiplying!


__________________
><`SAM`;{°<

Current Tank Info: 26 gal Bowfront foam wall build: http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=2457621
Foam Wall Instructable: http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php
sam.basye is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10/18/2017, 06:55 AM   #2780
Chasmodes
Registered Member
 
Chasmodes's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: Maryland
Posts: 571
Congrats on the sea grasses pearling!

Sorry to hear about the chromis. I know you were looking forward to them brightening your tank. Keep your chin up. It's all a learning process. Sometimes we take a step backward so we can move forward. Better luck next time.


__________________
Blennies Rock!

--Kevin Wilson

Current Tank Info: 101g 3'X3'X18" Cubish Oyster Reef Blenny tank, 36"X17"X18" sump
Chasmodes is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10/18/2017, 07:50 AM   #2781
McPuff
Registered Member
 
McPuff's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2012
Location: Michigan
Posts: 1,091
Hooray for the plant success! Very cool.

Boo to the fish deaths. Sorry to hear that. But you have a good attitude going forward. And it's better to have happened in QT!!! Others will learn from your mistakes if they actually pay attention. The important thing really is that you learn from it (obviously you have!).

Sounds like you'll need to carry that paranoia forward as it pertains to QT and fish disease. I have often asked myself, "do I really want to go through all that work?" Then I think about the consequences of NOT doing it. Yes, even though the fish or coral came from someone's clean and healthy tank, there is still a possibility that disease is hitching a ride. An ounce of prevention...

Don't give up on the Vanderbilts. I'm sure you'll have success with the next batch if you can give them a sterile environment. I'd suggest doing TTM first, and then dropping them into a clean QT tank. Have you had uronema in your display tank?


McPuff is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10/18/2017, 10:16 AM   #2782
Michael Hoaster
Registered Member
 
Michael Hoaster's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Boulder, CO
Posts: 2,755
Chasmodes, sam.basye, and McPuff, thanks for the encouraging words! I agree, a little paranoia is a good thing, when it comes to new fish. I've benefitted from my come one, come all attitude with plants, getting several freebies and hitchhikers, but with fish, not so much.

From here on out, I plan to be a stickler for details, regarding QT. It's a pretty safe assumption that every fish you get, comes with some kind of 'nasty'. In the sea, these nasties usually aren't a problem, but in our closed systems they quickly get out of hand. So, it's quarantine paranoia from here on out!

Luckily, uronema was never introduced to my display tank. And the hypo seems to have worked at eradicating ICK. So my display is safe. I think…


__________________
As many naturalists and environmentalists have suggested, we should set aside our arrogance,
our desire to conquer and control everything, and walk hand in hand with Mother Nature. -Walter Adey

Current Tank Info: 180g Seagrass-Mangrove Mudbank Lagoon
Michael Hoaster is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10/19/2017, 01:47 PM   #2783
Chasmodes
Registered Member
 
Chasmodes's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: Maryland
Posts: 571
Sounds like a good plan for the future. I just went the hypo route last night on my 20g high. If it works, then the 20g high will be my QT tank once the larger tank is ready to go.


__________________
Blennies Rock!

--Kevin Wilson

Current Tank Info: 101g 3'X3'X18" Cubish Oyster Reef Blenny tank, 36"X17"X18" sump
Chasmodes is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10/25/2017, 11:17 PM   #2784
Michael Hoaster
Registered Member
 
Michael Hoaster's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Boulder, CO
Posts: 2,755
I've had the new 5200K metal halide for about a week now. It's bright and it's yellow! It reminds me of when I get an occasional natural sun ray from a window. With the CO2 and ammonia dosing, I'm getting some fast-growing macros going. The black grasilaria is everywhere and it's not pretty! I exported a bunch today and I've got more to go. It was cool as a single, novel plant, but now it's trying to overrun my tank. Ulva is making a comeback. I think it might outpace the snails. I'm especially happy to see some growing from one of the fake roots. Every time I looked at the tank today, it was bigger! Also, I'm getting some bleaching on a lot of the macros in the bright, left end of the tank. So, I'm moving some further to the right. The chondria that I placed up very high in the tank looks to be suffering in the new light. It has lost its irridescense. I'll have to move it down/over a bit.

The new purple plume gorgonian looks great. Good polyp extension and no apparent injury from my rough placement handling. It seems to be placed well for feeding and for photosynthesizing. Have I finally found a gorgonian I can keep alive? Stay tuned!

I've noticed more sponges around the tank-mostly the pink ones. I'm sure they've got plenty to eat. I've been re-reading steve Tyree's book,"The Environmental Gradient". Contrary to everything else I've read, he advocates SLOW currents for them. He's had incredible sponge growth with no food input whatsoever! The corals' slime, plus pelagic bacteria and dissolved organic carbon are naturally filtered by the sponges. Way cool. I had hoped to get some big, pretty 'show' sponges going, but it hasn't happened for me yet. Someday though!

The three sailfin and four barnacle blennies are all doing well. They're still hanging out in the dimmer end of the tank, so they're not all that visible unless you look for them. Big Daddy Gramma and the last molly are also doing well.

With the light fish load, the plants are the stars of the show these days. It's less interesting visually, but I like focusing on getting them well established first.


__________________
As many naturalists and environmentalists have suggested, we should set aside our arrogance,
our desire to conquer and control everything, and walk hand in hand with Mother Nature. -Walter Adey

Current Tank Info: 180g Seagrass-Mangrove Mudbank Lagoon
Michael Hoaster is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10/26/2017, 03:06 AM   #2785
McPuff
Registered Member
 
McPuff's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2012
Location: Michigan
Posts: 1,091
Quote:
Originally Posted by Michael Hoaster View Post
The new purple plume gorgonian looks great. Good polyp extension and no apparent injury from my rough placement handling. It seems to be placed well for feeding and for photosynthesizing. Have I finally found a gorgonian I can keep alive? Stay tuned!
Very cool! I looked this up and have to consider it for my tank as I'm looking to add a gorgonian. Do you know if you've got Antillogorgia elisabethae or A. americana? Apparently the former has more and smaller branches and therefore looks more natural [in smaller pieces] in the aquarium.


McPuff is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10/26/2017, 07:01 AM   #2786
Chasmodes
Registered Member
 
Chasmodes's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: Maryland
Posts: 571
Great update. Interesting about the Ulva making a comeback, nice Great news about the gorgonian too.


__________________
Blennies Rock!

--Kevin Wilson

Current Tank Info: 101g 3'X3'X18" Cubish Oyster Reef Blenny tank, 36"X17"X18" sump
Chasmodes is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10/26/2017, 10:10 AM   #2787
Michael Hoaster
Registered Member
 
Michael Hoaster's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Boulder, CO
Posts: 2,755
Purple Plume (Pseudopterogorgia bipinnata), is what they called it at live-plantsdotcom, where I got it. They also have several others. What sold me on it was the description of "very hardy and a fast grower". I like to see the word "hardy" for everything I get!

The ulva comeback is a complete surprise. The new bulb helps, but I think there are other factors. Some green sea hares have hitchhiked in recently and reproduced. They may be a direct competitor with the mini strombus snails. I've noticed fewer of them lately and many more of the cerith snails. The strombus really chowed down on the ulva, so I may be seeing a shift in dominance at the snail level of the trophic pyramid. That works for me, as the strombus have made it difficult to introduce new macro species, with their ravenous consumption. I don't think the ceriths go after the macros.

It's kind of interesting, seeing how the 'cast of thousands' affect my tank. Kind of like the pawns of the ecological chessboard! It seems my tank is trying to teach me how all the parts in this ecosystem-in-a-box work together. I think I'm learning that I don't need or want to impose my will on it with a heavy-handed approach, but to try nudging things and then sit back and see what happens!


__________________
As many naturalists and environmentalists have suggested, we should set aside our arrogance,
our desire to conquer and control everything, and walk hand in hand with Mother Nature. -Walter Adey

Current Tank Info: 180g Seagrass-Mangrove Mudbank Lagoon
Michael Hoaster is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10/27/2017, 03:09 AM   #2788
McPuff
Registered Member
 
McPuff's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2012
Location: Michigan
Posts: 1,091
Quote:
Originally Posted by Michael Hoaster View Post
Purple Plume (Pseudopterogorgia bipinnata), is what they called it at live-plantsdotcom, where I got it. They also have several others. What sold me on it was the description of "very hardy and a fast grower". I like to see the word "hardy" for everything I get!
Yes, I feel the same way!! This also looks like a nice species. I may just end up getting one of these, or one of the type I mentioned above... whatever I can find. All are said to be hardy and fast growing. And they are nicely colored. Perfect!


McPuff is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10/27/2017, 07:10 AM   #2789
Chasmodes
Registered Member
 
Chasmodes's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: Maryland
Posts: 571
Quote:
Originally Posted by Michael Hoaster View Post
It's kind of interesting, seeing how the 'cast of thousands' affect my tank. Kind of like the pawns of the ecological chessboard! It seems my tank is trying to teach me how all the parts in this ecosystem-in-a-box work together. I think I'm learning that I don't need or want to impose my will on it with a heavy-handed approach, but to try nudging things and then sit back and see what happens!
I love this approach. My only problem in attempting it is that I swiped most of my chess pieces onto the floor! Seriously, we've mentioned it before, the quote from Jurassic Park, "Life finds a way...", it is a fascinating process watching the evolution of an aquarium into a mini ecosystem.


__________________
Blennies Rock!

--Kevin Wilson

Current Tank Info: 101g 3'X3'X18" Cubish Oyster Reef Blenny tank, 36"X17"X18" sump
Chasmodes is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10/27/2017, 08:25 AM   #2790
Subsea
Registered Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Austin, Tx
Posts: 1,337
Quote:
Originally Posted by Michael Hoaster View Post
Purple Plume (Pseudopterogorgia bipinnata), is what they called it at live-plantsdotcom, where I got it. They also have several others. What sold me on it was the description of "very hardy and a fast grower". I like to see the word "hardy" for everything I get!

The ulva comeback is a complete surprise. The new bulb helps, but I think there are other factors. Some green sea hares have hitchhiked in recently and reproduced. They may be a direct competitor with the mini strombus snails. I've noticed fewer of them lately and many more of the cerith snails. The strombus really chowed down on the ulva, so I may be seeing a shift in dominance at the snail level of the trophic pyramid. That works for me, as the strombus have made it difficult to introduce new macro species, with their ravenous consumption. I don't think the ceriths go after the macros.

It's kind of interesting, seeing how the 'cast of thousands' affect my tank. Kind of like the pawns of the ecological chessboard! It seems my tank is trying to teach me how all the parts in this ecosystem-in-a-box work together. I think I'm learning that I don't need or want to impose my will on it with a heavy-handed approach, but to try nudging things and then sit back and see what happens!
Michael,
I have so much enjoyed reading your post and your overall philosophy of keeping Marine ornamentals coincides with mine. I find that the less I do, the better things are in the tank.


__________________
Laissez les bons temps rouler,
Patrick Castille

Current Tank Info: 10,000G. Greenhouse Macro Growout
Subsea is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10/27/2017, 08:39 AM   #2791
Subsea
Registered Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Austin, Tx
Posts: 1,337
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chasmodes View Post
I love this approach. My only problem in attempting it is that I swiped most of my chess pieces onto the floor! Seriously, we've mentioned it before, the quote from Jurassic Park, "Life finds a way...", it is a fascinating process watching the evolution of an aquarium into a mini ecosystem.

As more than a casual observer of nature, I have seen the same sceanario develope a climax forest, in which giant Oakes and beech shade out the weeds. Things started out as grasses and weeds, then bushes and saplings and vines. Then eventually into a majestic climax forest.

I could wish that my tank did it by itself but I like getting my hands wet. I enjoy gardening. It gives me a peace and a serenity that I find in very few places.


__________________
Laissez les bons temps rouler,
Patrick Castille

Current Tank Info: 10,000G. Greenhouse Macro Growout
Subsea is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10/27/2017, 08:51 AM   #2792
Michael Hoaster
Registered Member
 
Michael Hoaster's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Boulder, CO
Posts: 2,755
Right on, McPuff! I went back and looked at all the gorgonians they sell, and the one I chose sounded like the hardiest, but they had several to choose from. It was also about twice as big as they list them. Their plants, snails and live sand are the best I've come across, and their shipping is the cheapest!

Chasmodes, I'm loving it too! Prioritizing the whole ecosystem over any one species is fascinating and rewarding. I keep chipping away at it, trying to fill in all the puzzle pieces. Right now, if I could add anything I wanted, I'd get mini brittle stars, a bunch of feather dusters and a few of the small clams that live in seagrass beds, which are said to use up the hydrogen sulfide that accumulates in the substrate.

Between the serpent stars and the sea cucumber, I've just about got the accumulating detritus under control. I was very tempted to vacuum, but I'm glad I didn't now. I'm letting Mother Nature do the work for me!


__________________
As many naturalists and environmentalists have suggested, we should set aside our arrogance,
our desire to conquer and control everything, and walk hand in hand with Mother Nature. -Walter Adey

Current Tank Info: 180g Seagrass-Mangrove Mudbank Lagoon
Michael Hoaster is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10/27/2017, 08:51 AM   #2793
Subsea
Registered Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Austin, Tx
Posts: 1,337
Photoadaptability

Michael,

I just moved some Gracilaria Hayi from a low light tumble culture and placed it next to Red Grapes moved from low light area. Note the dark burgundy color of both, which I find very attractive. Previously, when I received Red Grapes from the divers, it was a rich dark burgundy. Then, after being under more intense light it paled up, dropped flotation berries and in general looked bad. I now have beaucoup short red grapes popping up everywhere, including high light areas.

Not sure why, but I can’t post a picture.


__________________
Laissez les bons temps rouler,
Patrick Castille

Current Tank Info: 10,000G. Greenhouse Macro Growout
Subsea is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10/27/2017, 09:12 AM   #2794
Michael Hoaster
Registered Member
 
Michael Hoaster's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Boulder, CO
Posts: 2,755
Thanks, Subsea! Kind words.

It's fun, down here in the weirdo basement, isn't it? Letting Nature teach me what to do is like unraveling a mystery! It is very much a form of gardening, but more involved, I think. Eco-gardening? Sure, the plants are great, but figuring out what other players are appropriate for the ecosystem makes it that much more interesting. And I have to admit, I enjoy doing things differently than the vast majority of folks in this hobby!


__________________
As many naturalists and environmentalists have suggested, we should set aside our arrogance,
our desire to conquer and control everything, and walk hand in hand with Mother Nature. -Walter Adey

Current Tank Info: 180g Seagrass-Mangrove Mudbank Lagoon
Michael Hoaster is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10/27/2017, 09:44 AM   #2795
Michael Hoaster
Registered Member
 
Michael Hoaster's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Boulder, CO
Posts: 2,755
Subsea, I too am moving plants, since adding a new, brighter bulb. My chondria, hypnea, nemastoma and botriocladia are all getting moved to dimmer lighting. Having a light gradient in my tank is turning out to be quite helpful for this.


__________________
As many naturalists and environmentalists have suggested, we should set aside our arrogance,
our desire to conquer and control everything, and walk hand in hand with Mother Nature. -Walter Adey

Current Tank Info: 180g Seagrass-Mangrove Mudbank Lagoon
Michael Hoaster is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10/28/2017, 02:57 PM   #2796
Michael Hoaster
Registered Member
 
Michael Hoaster's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Boulder, CO
Posts: 2,755

Post Simulated Herbivore Grazing Event. Note the gorgonian, and other fun stuff on the back wall.



A lot of the reds got moved to the live rock area, in search of dimmer light and deeper colors.



The less dominant male sailfin blenny and wormy friends.



A pretty good look at the new greens on the back wall.


__________________
As many naturalists and environmentalists have suggested, we should set aside our arrogance,
our desire to conquer and control everything, and walk hand in hand with Mother Nature. -Walter Adey

Current Tank Info: 180g Seagrass-Mangrove Mudbank Lagoon
Michael Hoaster is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10/28/2017, 10:49 PM   #2797
Michael Hoaster
Registered Member
 
Michael Hoaster's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Boulder, CO
Posts: 2,755
Big prune and export today. It looks like I'm about to get a surge in greens coming up soon. I'm psyched!

I snapped a few more:



Full width. Note the ulva growing from the fake root. Ulva has popped up in a few places lately-attached. I'd really love to be able to keep this plant going in the display, long term.



The dark side. The reds have come full circle. I started them out at the end and now they're back.



I'm starting to get some good variety on the back wall.



Hopefully next time I photo theses reds, they will be darker.



I love that this gorgonian is soft and flexy, so it moves in the current very nicely.


__________________
As many naturalists and environmentalists have suggested, we should set aside our arrogance,
our desire to conquer and control everything, and walk hand in hand with Mother Nature. -Walter Adey

Current Tank Info: 180g Seagrass-Mangrove Mudbank Lagoon
Michael Hoaster is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10/30/2017, 08:33 AM   #2798
Chasmodes
Registered Member
 
Chasmodes's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: Maryland
Posts: 571
Yay, pic update! Absolutely a beautiful tank. Everything seems to be working nicely again! Thanks for sharing your pics!!!!


__________________
Blennies Rock!

--Kevin Wilson

Current Tank Info: 101g 3'X3'X18" Cubish Oyster Reef Blenny tank, 36"X17"X18" sump
Chasmodes is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10/30/2017, 11:00 AM   #2799
Michael Hoaster
Registered Member
 
Michael Hoaster's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Boulder, CO
Posts: 2,755
Thanks Chasmodes! It's funny, I take pics AFTER I've ripped most of the macros out of there, so you see it in it's post-haircut look. I should post some pics somewhere between this and overgrown, so I'm showing more of what it really looks like, most of the time.


Here you can see a little of the pearling I was talking about. I went in and cleared off the DSB of most of the macros that were creeping in. I want to have a good view of any new growth in the grasses. I'm seeing one or two new shoots but nothing major yet.

The red and the black gracilarias have become like a turf. Rather than single plants, hundreds of tiny versions are encrusting the DSB rock planter especially. It's not a good look. After hours of obsessively picking them out, there are still tons of them littering the bottom. This is where a temporary herbivorous fish would come in handy. Bring it in for a week or so to clean up, then remove it to the quarantine tank. I'd be all over that idea except for the issue of catching the fish!

For the most part, I'm happy with how things are progressing. Right now, the thing I'm most excited about is the back wall. I'm finally getting a good variety of plants growing on it. If all goes well, it should be getting pretty impressive in the next month or so. The seagrasses still seem pretty stagnant. The pearling is a very good sign, so I'll stay the course and keep observing. The caulerpa racemosa peltata continues to grow back. I'm happy to see it return, as well as the green color it brings. I just need to keep it in check, so it doesn't overrun everything else.


__________________
As many naturalists and environmentalists have suggested, we should set aside our arrogance,
our desire to conquer and control everything, and walk hand in hand with Mother Nature. -Walter Adey

Current Tank Info: 180g Seagrass-Mangrove Mudbank Lagoon
Michael Hoaster is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10/30/2017, 11:07 AM   #2800
sam.basye
Registered Member
 
sam.basye's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2014
Location: Lynchburg, VA
Posts: 1,097
Looking good Michael!

Questions..

Is there gorgonian purple with white polyps?

I've been noticing a lot of your pictures have been more greenish-blue. Is that the new bulb or are the pictures getting a little more saturated?


The dark end looks very natural!


Edit: damn... How have you gotten to 2800 posts?? Haha keep it up!


__________________
><`SAM`;{°<

Current Tank Info: 26 gal Bowfront foam wall build: http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=2457621
Foam Wall Instructable: http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php
sam.basye is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Tags
biotope, caribbean, food chain detrivores, macro algae, seagrass

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -6. The time now is 03:06 AM.


TapaTalk Enabled

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Powered by Searchlight © 2017 Axivo Inc.
Use of this web site is subject to the terms and conditions described in the user agreement.
Reef CentralTM Reef Central, LLC. Copyright ©1999-2014