Nitrate dosing long term log - Page 2

Toby_Kourtney · 02/06/2017, 07:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bertoni

Looks like some nice animals.

I'm glad that you are making progress.

Thanks man

coralmoral · 02/06/2017, 08:19 PM

I love this idea! I will definitely keep following your progress. Keep us updated!

scar79 · 02/08/2017, 08:19 PM

Keep this thread going Toby! I did some experimenting with nitrate dosing and definitely noticed immediate improvements in the richness of color in my corals. I eventually stopped dosing and took a 2 month water change hiatus and my hair algae (present before I started dosing nitrate) got out of hand. Experimenting with a chaeto reactor now, and may revisit nitrate dosing once the hair algae is gone.

Toby_Kourtney · 03/03/2017, 02:46 PM

So it seems the issue I'm running into now is that raising my nitrates to 4 ppm has causes my phosphates to bottom out completely to 0.00 with a Hanna checker. I dose 2 ppm of nitrates with kno3 weekly to maintain 4 ppm nitrate. I'm wondering what everyone's opinion is on dosing phosphates to maintain 0.03 ppm. I've tried feeding more for 2 weeks but my phosphates having budged and my montis especially aren't maintaining food color.

bertoni · 03/03/2017, 06:27 PM

Well, you could try dosing a food-grade trisodium phosphate product, as an experiment. I think a large supply is fairly inexpensive on Amazon.

Toby_Kourtney · 03/04/2017, 01:24 AM

I ordered some mono potassium phosphate from a reputable website that specializes in fresh water planted tanks for 5 bucks. Based on my calculations if I mix 1/2 teaspoon with 500 ml of ro/di water each ml of solution will cause a .01 increase in phosphate.

bertoni · 03/04/2017, 05:56 PM

Okay, that should be fine, too.

00101 · 03/08/2017, 10:21 AM

If one is looking to dose nitrates is it better to dose NaNO3 or KNO3? I don't test for Potassium as it is.

Toby_Kourtney · 03/08/2017, 11:23 AM

By my calculations it shouldn't matter. In every scenario I ran it wasn't possible to dose enough kno3 to make a noticeable difference in potassium.

00101 · 03/08/2017, 11:58 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Toby_Kourtney

By my calculations it shouldn't matter. In every scenario I ran it wasn't possible to dose enough kno3 to make a noticeable difference in potassium.

That's kind of what I figured. A few ppm on Potassium or Sodium is meaningless.

tmz · 03/08/2017, 12:07 PM

Overtime K/potassium can build up;It's normal seawater level is a mere 380ppm vs. sodium on the other hand at around 10,800 ppm .

bertoni · 03/08/2017, 05:00 PM

I'd dose sodium nitrate, but it's probably safe enough to use potassium if you keep up a good water change schedule.

kevin.st · 03/09/2017, 09:34 AM

I've been dosing potassium nitrate for a few weeks and have noticed a small increase in coloration. I am adding 1/4 teaspoon every couple of days and my nitrates are around 2-5-its hard to know exactly with RS test kits.

It is working, in my opinion. Pretty crazy to think that I would be ADDING nitrates!

Toby_Kourtney · 03/10/2017, 02:42 PM

I got my mono potassium phosphate in today. I made a known solution to calibrate the Hanna checker and w a .03 solution the checker read .05. I then dosed .03 in the aquarium and got .05 so it seems the checker is only .02 off which is pretty impressive for a 50 dollar tester. I am using a dosed to add .16 nitrate and .01 phosphates daily. I check parameters in a week to see where they are at.

TOOMANYFISH · 03/10/2017, 10:15 PM

Tagging along

Toby_Kourtney · 03/11/2017, 05:20 PM

The corals are showing the best polyp extension I've seen so far. Nitrates are at 4 ppm phosphates .05 ppm.

bertoni · 03/11/2017, 07:36 PM

That sounds like nice progress!

Jwheld · 03/12/2017, 04:50 PM

Corals are looking good!

Are you also spot feeding, or are they purely filter needing from the nutrients dosed?

Toby_Kourtney · 03/12/2017, 05:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jwheld

Corals are looking good!

Are you also spot feeding, or are they purely filter needing from the nutrients dosed?

I broadcast feed 2 scoops of reef chili daily with pumps off.

Toby_Kourtney · 03/12/2017, 10:40 PM

So I checked my nitrates and phosphates today and they are both 0.00. Yesterday my nitrates were 4 and I dosed phosphate up to 0.05.
The only thing I can think of is that the 0.00 I had for phosphates before I started dosing them was keeping the nitrates from being consumed (I hope that makes sense). I dosed my nitrates manually to .8 ppm and phosphates to 0.05. I have my doser set up to do this daily now. I'll check this weekend to see if it bottoms out again.

Toby_Kourtney · 03/14/2017, 04:48 PM

After dosing. 05 phosphates and .8 nitrates 2 days in a row at the end of the day I'm still showing 0 phosphate and 0 nitrate. I'm convinced since I'm dosing a 16:1 ratio my refugium is soaking up all my nutrients at night. My zoas I've had for 2 years that haven't gained a single polyp are starting to reproduce so I'm thinking trace amounts are staying in my system. So basically I'm constantly importing and exporting nutrients.

bertoni · 03/14/2017, 05:29 PM

Okay, I think you've found a reasonable dose for the tank. Congratulations! It's interesting seeing how this unfolds.

dostjustin1 · 03/14/2017, 07:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Toby_Kourtney

From a cost point I think if I can get to a stable point where I know how much potassium nitrate and vinegar to add to maintain nitrates at 4 pmm while slowly lowering phosphates I'll be much better off. Maybe it's just me but gfo is expensive and if I can do the same thing for practically nothing then why not.

Any reason you use vinegar? Is it just a cost thing or is it better than say vodka

Sent from my LGMS550 using Tapatalk

bertoni · 03/14/2017, 08:49 PM

Some tanks seem to do a bit better with vodka; some seem to do a bit better with vinegar. I don't know exactly why, but the issue usually is microbial blooms.

Toby_Kourtney · 03/15/2017, 01:09 PM

I'm pretty convinced through observation and testing that the key to lowering nitrates with a refugium is to raise phosphates and lowering phosphates by raising nitrates. I did this with my high tech planted tank for years. My phosphate level were dosed to 1 ppm and nitrates were dosed to 10 ppm everyday and I had no algae because the plants were out competing it for nutrients. I think balancing nutrients is more effective than having both undetectable.

03/03/2017, 06:27 PM	#30
bertoni RC Mod Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Mountain View, CA, USA Posts: 88,616	Well, you could try dosing a food-grade trisodium phosphate product, as an experiment. I think a large supply is fairly inexpensive on Amazon. __________________ Jonathan Bertoni

03/04/2017, 05:56 PM	#32
bertoni RC Mod Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Mountain View, CA, USA Posts: 88,616	Okay, that should be fine, too. __________________ Jonathan Bertoni

03/08/2017, 12:07 PM	#36
tmz ReefKeeping Mag staff Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: West Seneca NY Posts: 27,691	Overtime K/potassium can build up;It's normal seawater level is a mere 380ppm vs. sodium on the other hand at around 10,800 ppm . __________________ Tom Current Tank Info: Tank of the Month , November 2011 : 600gal integrated system: 3 display tanks (120 g, 90g, 89g),several frag/grow out tanks, macroalgae refugia, cryptic zones. 40+ fish, seahorses, sps,lps,leathers, zoanthidae and non photosynthetic corals.

03/08/2017, 05:00 PM	#37
bertoni RC Mod Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Mountain View, CA, USA Posts: 88,616	I'd dose sodium nitrate, but it's probably safe enough to use potassium if you keep up a good water change schedule. __________________ Jonathan Bertoni

03/11/2017, 07:36 PM	#42
bertoni RC Mod Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Mountain View, CA, USA Posts: 88,616	That sounds like nice progress! __________________ Jonathan Bertoni

02/06/2017, 08:19 PM	#27
coralmoral Registered Member Join Date: May 2012 Location: Mount Sinai, NY Posts: 58	I love this idea! I will definitely keep following your progress. Keep us updated!

02/08/2017, 08:19 PM	#28
scar79 Registered Member Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: Southwestern CT Posts: 534	Keep this thread going Toby! I did some experimenting with nitrate dosing and definitely noticed immediate improvements in the richness of color in my corals. I eventually stopped dosing and took a 2 month water change hiatus and my hair algae (present before I started dosing nitrate) got out of hand. Experimenting with a chaeto reactor now, and may revisit nitrate dosing once the hair algae is gone.

03/03/2017, 02:46 PM	#29
Toby_Kourtney Registered Member Join Date: Feb 2014 Location: Minot ND Posts: 255	So it seems the issue I'm running into now is that raising my nitrates to 4 ppm has causes my phosphates to bottom out completely to 0.00 with a Hanna checker. I dose 2 ppm of nitrates with kno3 weekly to maintain 4 ppm nitrate. I'm wondering what everyone's opinion is on dosing phosphates to maintain 0.03 ppm. I've tried feeding more for 2 weeks but my phosphates having budged and my montis especially aren't maintaining food color.

03/04/2017, 01:24 AM	#31
Toby_Kourtney Registered Member Join Date: Feb 2014 Location: Minot ND Posts: 255	I ordered some mono potassium phosphate from a reputable website that specializes in fresh water planted tanks for 5 bucks. Based on my calculations if I mix 1/2 teaspoon with 500 ml of ro/di water each ml of solution will cause a .01 increase in phosphate.

03/08/2017, 10:21 AM	#33
00101 Registered Member Join Date: Dec 2012 Posts: 125	If one is looking to dose nitrates is it better to dose NaNO3 or KNO3? I don't test for Potassium as it is.

03/08/2017, 11:23 AM	#34
Toby_Kourtney Registered Member Join Date: Feb 2014 Location: Minot ND Posts: 255	By my calculations it shouldn't matter. In every scenario I ran it wasn't possible to dose enough kno3 to make a noticeable difference in potassium.

03/09/2017, 09:34 AM	#38
kevin.st Registered Member Join Date: Apr 2015 Location: SLC, UT Posts: 151	I've been dosing potassium nitrate for a few weeks and have noticed a small increase in coloration. I am adding 1/4 teaspoon every couple of days and my nitrates are around 2-5-its hard to know exactly with RS test kits. It is working, in my opinion. Pretty crazy to think that I would be ADDING nitrates!

03/10/2017, 02:42 PM	#39
Toby_Kourtney Registered Member Join Date: Feb 2014 Location: Minot ND Posts: 255	I got my mono potassium phosphate in today. I made a known solution to calibrate the Hanna checker and w a .03 solution the checker read .05. I then dosed .03 in the aquarium and got .05 so it seems the checker is only .02 off which is pretty impressive for a 50 dollar tester. I am using a dosed to add .16 nitrate and .01 phosphates daily. I check parameters in a week to see where they are at.

03/10/2017, 10:15 PM	#40
TOOMANYFISH Registered Member Join Date: Sep 2004 Location: Boston Posts: 119	Tagging along

03/11/2017, 05:20 PM	#41
Toby_Kourtney Registered Member Join Date: Feb 2014 Location: Minot ND Posts: 255	The corals are showing the best polyp extension I've seen so far. Nitrates are at 4 ppm phosphates .05 ppm.

03/12/2017, 04:50 PM	#43
Jwheld Registered Member Join Date: May 2016 Posts: 106	Corals are looking good! Are you also spot feeding, or are they purely filter needing from the nutrients dosed?

03/12/2017, 10:40 PM	#45
Toby_Kourtney Registered Member Join Date: Feb 2014 Location: Minot ND Posts: 255	So I checked my nitrates and phosphates today and they are both 0.00. Yesterday my nitrates were 4 and I dosed phosphate up to 0.05. The only thing I can think of is that the 0.00 I had for phosphates before I started dosing them was keeping the nitrates from being consumed (I hope that makes sense). I dosed my nitrates manually to .8 ppm and phosphates to 0.05. I have my doser set up to do this daily now. I'll check this weekend to see if it bottoms out again.

03/14/2017, 04:48 PM	#46
Toby_Kourtney Registered Member Join Date: Feb 2014 Location: Minot ND Posts: 255	After dosing. 05 phosphates and .8 nitrates 2 days in a row at the end of the day I'm still showing 0 phosphate and 0 nitrate. I'm convinced since I'm dosing a 16:1 ratio my refugium is soaking up all my nutrients at night. My zoas I've had for 2 years that haven't gained a single polyp are starting to reproduce so I'm thinking trace amounts are staying in my system. So basically I'm constantly importing and exporting nutrients.

03/14/2017, 05:29 PM	#47
bertoni RC Mod Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Mountain View, CA, USA Posts: 88,616	Okay, I think you've found a reasonable dose for the tank. Congratulations! It's interesting seeing how this unfolds. __________________ Jonathan Bertoni

03/14/2017, 08:49 PM	#49
bertoni RC Mod Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Mountain View, CA, USA Posts: 88,616	Some tanks seem to do a bit better with vodka; some seem to do a bit better with vinegar. I don't know exactly why, but the issue usually is microbial blooms. __________________ Jonathan Bertoni

03/15/2017, 01:09 PM	#50
Toby_Kourtney Registered Member Join Date: Feb 2014 Location: Minot ND Posts: 255	I'm pretty convinced through observation and testing that the key to lowering nitrates with a refugium is to raise phosphates and lowering phosphates by raising nitrates. I did this with my high tech planted tank for years. My phosphate level were dosed to 1 ppm and nitrates were dosed to 10 ppm everyday and I had no algae because the plants were out competing it for nutrients. I think balancing nutrients is more effective than having both undetectable.