A First Plywood Project...

[Sean : EbN]

Hello everyone,

I have been a member here at Reef Central for a long time (actually had to re-join at some point a few years ago) and I have always enjoyed lurking around this sub-forum as well as the Large Tank & SPS sub-forums. I recently had the desire to build a tank. Most of my ideas and inspiration has come from a tank that was made by Acro which can be seen at this link...http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/sh...5&pagenumber=1

Over the last few days I have been working on it a few hours at a time. I'm really trying to be patient (which is SO unlike me) so hopefully it will progress slowly and nicely. The main display volume is about 300 gallons and measures 96 x 24 x 30. The overflow trough volume is about 40 gallons and measures 96 x 8 x 12 making the whole tank "box" 96 x 32 x 30 (minus the rear area under the trough of course)

I decided to use 3/4 inch 10 ply Birch Plywood. The construction of the "box" required 6 full sheets of plywood, including the "euro-style" top that is not in place in these photographs. The front panel is 2 panels thick making it 1.5 inches. I glued the structure together with Heavy-Duty Liquid Nails and Deck King 2.5 inch deck screws.

I will be using the West Systems Epoxy for sealing the wood. Tonight I almost finished filleting all the interior seems with Epoxy mixed with fairing filler. This will put a "bead" (just like silicone in a glass aquarium) in all the interior seems that will be hard as a rock when cured adding TONS of strength to the joints. This should take away the need for any sort of interior corner bracing such as 2x2's which some people use. Once these fillets are finished I will sand them down to a nice smooth contour and then start applying the fiberglass woven cloth to the interior of the tank with the West Systems Epoxy. Once the cloth is "wet-out" I will apply the second coat with the blue resin tint. Then a few more coats I'm sure... I guess I have enough work cut out for me soon.

I will try my best to get a bunch of photos of the project as it goes through the stages. As for the sump, stand and other equiptment... I'll map all that out later. So in the meantime, here are some pics...





A couple photos of me in it for size comparison (I'm not a big fella!)





Thanks a lot for looking and I will be updating this thread as I go! Please let me know if you have any questions/suggestions!

[kgross]

What are you planning on using for your viewing pain? So far it looks very nice, I don't think you need your overflow area to be as large as you made it, but it will give you extra water volume.

Kim

[Sean : EbN]

Hello Kim,

Thanks for the kind words! I think, as of now, I will be using a 1/2 inch pane of tempered glass that will measure about 93 x 27 inches. I have thought about using Acrylic or maybe even trying to find someone who can laminate some Starfire just like Acro did on his tank. I can't get the tank in its final resting place until after Christmas so I have plenty of time to decide. I would like to test fill it in my shop/warehouse for a while first.

As for the overflow... I like the continuous design and it will give me plenty of space to plumb in return lines for the sump and closed loop systems I am planning. This tank will be installed with its rear up against a wall so the shallow trough design will allow me to access the bottom of the trough easier than trying to reach down into a traditional overflow or a deeper trough design. At one point I thought about maybe developing the rear trough into some sort of mangrove refugium area... still pondering that one.

Thanks again... I hope to post some photos of the fillets tonight!

[Kevin McG]

Cut a couple of round holes in the sides (port holes)

I know somebody that did this and it looked awesome! not that yours doesn't, nice work!

[PHreef]

Looks nice Sean! I really like the overflow. Wish I did mine like that. Good luck, keep us posted.

[Sean : EbN]

Hello again everyone,

Kevin McG : Thanks for the kind words! I thought about doing something like that but this install will not be side accessible. Maybe I will do that one the next one

PHreef : Thanks for the compliments! I think it will be really nice to work in and around that large overflow. I'm really happy about not having any overflow boxes to obstruct the interior of the tank.

Now for the update...

I didn't spend much time on it today. I finished all the seem filleting and filled some holes on the fronts and the sides. I also "wet-out" one side of the interior of the tank with the clear epoxy mixture and the fiberglass cloth. It took a few minutes but overall it wasn't hard. I just mixed the epoxy, used a 3" paintbrush to slap it up on the fiberglass, starting in the center. I used a 4" plastic spreader (blade type no teeth) to start at the center and work the epoxy outward towards the corners. Again... a little time consuming but really easy.

I also spread the first coat of clear epoxy on the inside of the overflow trough over the finished and sanded seem fillets. I think the fillet method is going to work out really well, it should make all the seems really smooth and easy to get algae off of!

I think my next step is to attach the "euro-style" top so that I can fillet its seems as well and then "wet-out" the rest of the inside and start applying my blue tinted coats. It seems to be moving right along and so far I am happy with the result.

Here is the one problem that I will have... the glass won't fit in after the top is installed! Kind of a pain because I couldn't make the tank any wider because of width constraints. To give the proper overlap of at least 1.5 inches all the way around it is a good bit too large to fit in any way through the front or top. I think I will build the entire tank and finish it out, then notch a slot in the top that is 1" wide at the center of the side length (if you get my drift.) Then after the viewing glass is installed, I can repair the notch with epoxy and fiberglass and it SHOULD be as strong as the plywood that was there before it. Anyone see any problems with this resolution?!? I really appreciate the input!

On with the photos...

Screw holes filled with epoxy mixed with the purple #407 Fairing Filler...




West Systems group...


My first "wet-out"...


The "trough" with one coat of Epoxy over the fillets that I made with the Epoxy + #407 filler. I got the WRONG stuff... Definitely get the #405 Filleting Filler (which is a brown powder) as it will mix much thicker with less than the #407. I grabbed the wrong one a few days ago. They still came out really nice and smooth after a once-over with some sandpaper




Thanks again for looking... until next time...

[xdusty6920]

man that looks like an awesome design with the overflow smooth. ive thought that idea over and cant seem to overlook the fact that youd constantly have to pull fish out of the box. i hate the look of the teeth but they seem to be needed for fish. ive never seen this method of westsystems epoxy and fiberglass. can you go alittle more in depth on were to get all the materials and exactly how thier used step by step? i know youve already explained it some but ive never worked with fiberglass before

[Sean : EbN]

Hello xdusty6920,

Thanks for the kind words! As for the continuous overflow... check out the link that I posted above. He says he rarely ever has a problem with the fish in the overflow. I have it to where I can put teeth or egg crate on it in the future if need be.

As for the Epoxy... I felt the same way. I spent a few sessions scouring the web for ANY info on plywood tanks and all the good stuff came from here at RC. Most of the other methods were like the GARF method (body filler and 2 part Epoxy Paint) which I find to be a short term solution. If I am going to put that many hours into a project I want it to last indefinitely! Enter the West Systems products... go to their website http://www.westsystem.com/ I printed out their User's Manual which I found to be an outstanding reference! It tells you how to "wet-out" dry fiberglass cloth, make fillets in seams & produce a smooth bubble free final coat amongst other tips and tricks. Definitely a manual that serves its purpose.

As for where to get it... use their dealer locator. I have a West Marine store (no affiliation with West Systems manufactuer) about 10 minutes away that carries the entire product line. Nice to just pop in and buy what I need right away.

I found it very difficult to find a step-by-step building chronicle of a tank like this (epoxy resin, fiberglass cloth with color tint only) which didn't use the 2-part epoxy paint. Fiberglass resin STINKS! Its harder to measure out than the West System and you still have to sand it down and coat it with 2-3 coats of the epoxy paint. I think the previously mentioned fiberglass resin method is cheaper (epoxy is WICKED expensive) but it is more labor intensive it seems.

I hope that this will help answer your questions and also that through my progress there will be less confusion to the readers of this thread. I may not be updating anything tonight... busy day ahead.

Thanks again!

[DHyslop]

Originally posted by Sean : EbN
Hello xdusty6920,
I found it very difficult to find a step-by-step building chronicle of a tank like this (epoxy resin, fiberglass cloth with color tint only) which didn't use the 2-part epoxy paint. Fiberglass resin STINKS! Its harder to measure out than the West System and you still have to sand it down and coat it with 2-3 coats of the epoxy paint. I think the previously mentioned fiberglass resin method is cheaper (epoxy is WICKED expensive) but it is more labor intensive it seems.

By "fiberglass resin" I assume you mean polyester resin? The fumes are certifiably nasty. I think polyester is easier to measure since you don't need precision with the catalyst. Anyway, I think you're right to go epoxy all the way--no sense having two different resins in the project!

Tips for anyone starting a project like this:

Fiberglass and resin are also readily available online--I'm pretty sure its not considered hazmat as long as long as you're not getting drums of the stuff. If you're only local source is a West Marine or similar boat store, check out a place like www.mertons.com or www.raka.com. I ran out of fiberglass cloth in my boat project and picked up a little bit at West Marine once to hold me over until Merton's shipped. It cost me literally three times as much.

Dan

[CaptiveMarine]

Sean,

Very nice work. It's really hard to belive that this is your first plywood project. I'll be following this thread to see how it turns out.

Keep up the good work.

[Sean : EbN]

DHyslop : Yes... I was referring to polyester resin and it STINKS! As for the measuring of the epoxy... the West System has graduated pumps for their containers that couldn't be easier to use! It works 1+1 meaning that 1 pump of resin and 1 pump of hardener is the perfect ratio for mixing. I know other epoxy systems can be a problem with measuring but the West Systems folks have that licked!

I agree that West Marine is expensive for the cloth and supplies. I'm not using THAT much of it in this project so I didn't mind getting it right away. As for ordering the mixture off the internet, I didn't know who sold the West System online. I'm all ears if someone finds a source!

Breadman : To be honest... this is my first plywood AQUARIUM project. I have a good bit of experience working with wood projects. I always try to make it a fun learnign experience! Maybe I'll have some more photos tomorrow

Thanks everyone...

[DHyslop]

I must preface this by saying I've only ever personally worked with polyester resins, but it is my understanding that you can fit those pumps in most epoxy cans, minimizing the advantage of getting West Systems brand. Of the people I know of that use epoxy, I want to say that RAKA is the preferred brand.

But as you said, it is a small job, its not like its a 16' hovercraft necessitating 10 gallons of the stuff.

Dan

[jman77]

Sean...

Great looking tank so far !!! How much has the project cost you up to now ?

Man seeing some of these plywood tanks is making me want to build one when i move into my new house in a couple of months ....

Anyone know if you can make the final coat black instead of this blue final coat i keep seeing ?

[Sean : EbN]

Hello,

DHyslop : As long as the threaded necks on the containers are the same size and the mixing ratio is the same, I don't see how it could hurt to use the W.S. pumps on other brands. Nearly every plywood tank thread that I have read (that used epoxy) recommended the West stuff. Like you said... I don't need 10 gallons. Thanks a lot for your input.

jman77 : Honestly I probably won't add it all up until the system is completed. I have no idea how much epoxy I will end up using, I'm thinking 3 coats?? I was interested in doing this because I just like doing everything myself! At least if something goes wrong I don't want to kill anyone but ME!

Yes, you can tint the epoxy Black. Aquatic Ecosystem's Sweetwater brand paint comes in black also (if you wanted to do it the "stinky" way, with polyester resin). They had many different colors of tinting agent, I'm guessing you could mix them for darker/lighter shades also.

[Kent E]

Just finished a simular project and it holds water, I'm very happy. I say that if someone is handy then plywood tanks are the way to go. Keep at it, its looking great.

[Kevin McG]

Incredible!! I can't wait to see this when its done

[xdusty6920]

im interested in seeing exactly how the glass or acrylic is attached to the plywood itself. i imagine that the glass will be bigger then the opening and then a ring around the opening will be routed down so the glass lies flush in the wood. but how will you achieve a trust worthly seal between wood and glass?

[Sean : EbN]

Hello,

KentE: Thanks for the compliment! I'm glad your project was a success!

Kevin McG: Thanks... I'll keep update as I go. Seems like I've come down with the flu or something so I may be a few more days before there are more photo updates. Stay Tuned!

xdusty6920: The glass is adhered to the inside frame around the front. If you look at the link above there are some photos on one of those pages that show how Acro attached his front glass. I will have a 1.5 - 2" overlap all the way around. One would use many tubes of aquarium grade silicone to make the bond.

Take care everyone,

[Sean : EbN]

Hello everyone,

After a fun week of having the flu and not getting much done around here... I'm back! Since I started feeling better a few days ago I decided to start working on the tank again. Here is my most recent update :

First I finished filleting the inside of the tank, all except for around the top. I thought it would be easier to get most all the filleting done and leave the attachment and filleting of the top for last. I attached the top, again with the 2.5" DeckKing screws and heavy duty Liquid Nails. I used the same filleting mixture from before to fillet all the seams where the top meets the tank. I was surprised that it was so easy to do this inside the filter box. Apparently I left ample room to work in there which was quite a relief. Then I applied the rest of the fiberglass woven cloth to the interior of the tank. The other side, the back, bottom and around the face frame. I left all of the interior seams (where the fillets are) unclothed. I think I will go back with the 4" strips of cloth and fiberglass those also. I don't think its really that important for structure (the fillets are amazingly strong) but it will make for a smoother interior and provide more protection against damage from the rock structure.

Here are a few pics of the tank with the top on, all fillets complete and the interior fiberglassing all complete except for a few of the seams. I'll probably tackle that part tomorrow...







You can see in this photo that I my tank has 2 blue jean legs with Adidas shoes! Not a suitable stand, trust me, this thing is getting heavy!



So I filled the rest of the screw holes, chips, knicks and seams with the filleting mix and sanded them all down really nice and smooth *cough* Wear a dust mask!!

Then I decided to give the colored mix a shot... not so sure about this one! I bought this little tube of blue coloring agent for coloring resins etc. Not so sure this is going to work out. I mixed up some epoxy and coloring agent and it seemed nice and thick blue... that is until I rolled it on. It is much like a tinted clear coat when on the wood. I'm not sure if the color will get thicker after several coats or what?!? Any input anyone?? I read where people used the coloring agent used for coloring paint. Latex paint? Auto Paint? Tell me what to get and I'm all for it!

Here are a couple of pics of the tinited mix, rolled on with an adhesive roller, cured and sanded with 220 grit paper...





Looking at these photos, the blue tinted first coat is much darker in person but still very "clear." Before starting this project I ordered a gallon of dark blue Sweetwater Epoxy from Aquatic Ecosystems, thinking that I was going to polyester resin this thing and then paint it. The West System epoxy is virtually oderless and more watertight so I chose this route thinking I could tint the epoxy mixture. At $10 buck a tube for the blue coloring agent, it might not be a bad idea to just do the whole thing in clear and then use the gallon of Sweetwater paint that I already have. What are your thoughts?!? I need to make up my mind soon because after finishing the fiberglass cloth tomorrow, its all painting and sanding from then on!

Please let me know what you think! I'm open to any help and/or suggestions at this point!

Thanks for looking... this is a fun project but I'm ready to be done with it!

[Sean : EbN]

Hello everyone...

Just a quick update. I think I have decided to go ahead and use the Sweetwater dark blue paint that I already have to paint over the epoxy. I just finished the 3rd coat of West Systems epoxy on the inside of the tank. Tomorrow I will try to get the second coat on the exterior and then it will be ready for the 2-part paint.

This tank is STRONG! While moving the tank around on my saw horses I unbalanced it and it just ROLLED OFF! It did half of a flip before it hit the concrete floor on the upper right hand corner. The epoxy busted in a little because the wood gave under the impact but only had about a 1" square dent. I mixed up some more of that filleting powder + epoxy and repaired it. Now I just have to sand it down and put that second coat of epoxy on. I am pretty happy with how strong this thing is.

Now for a question... for all you guys that used the Sweetwater paint? Did you brush or roll it on? If you rolled it... what type of roller did you use? Also... did you measure out the 3 to 1 ratio and just mix as much as you needed or did you mix the whole gallon? I was just curious how long the gallon would last once mixed? Please respond if you have any insight at all.

Thanks for looking... hope to be putting glass in this thing soon!

[onetrickpony]

Most excellent, inspiring
Ken

[NY_Englishman]

Sean,

Thanks for documenting this. It is a great thread and I think your DIY tank is one of the best I've seen - it's well thought out and well made, too. I intend to do something similar and am eagerly watching your tank's development.

Please keep the information coming. I'll chime in wherever I can but it looks like you've got most bases covered.

Cheers,
Englishman

[Pyrojon]

How bout an epoxy gel coat. It comes in a zillion colors and should be available at your West Marine.

[Tingy99]

Great job so far!

Tagging along for the ride...

[glreefer]

all I have to say is wow, that really looks good. You have convinced me to make my own when I buy a house