Plumbing diagram suggestions...

mrichardson · 08/22/2006, 11:33 AM

Here is the plumbing I am planning for my new 100 gallon.

Please advise of any problems you see.

Qwiv · 08/22/2006, 11:42 AM

Looks fine.
I wouldn't reduce the size of your drain line unless you have to. Also look at a Durso or other stand pipe for your overflow. Will quiet it down. It is also a good idea to add a back-up drain, just in case something happens.

RichConley · 08/22/2006, 11:56 AM

Is the inlet on the GenX 3/4"? If so, reduce as close to the pump as possible. With a long run like that of 3/4, you may very well cavitate the pump.

mrichardson · 08/22/2006, 01:06 PM

The only reason I'm reducing from the overflow box into the sump, is because the sump was designed with a 1 1/4" inlet. I could remove the inlet for the sump, and just have a straight pipe down into the sump, but I figured it would splash too mich.

mrichardson · 08/22/2006, 01:07 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by RichConley
Is the inlet on the GenX 3/4"? If so, reduce as close to the pump as possible. With a long run like that of 3/4, you may very well cavitate the pump.

On the ruturn to the tank, or the input from the sump, or both?

mrichardson · 08/22/2006, 01:34 PM

Ok, here is a second draft...

In particular notice the three ball valves [bv1], [bv2], [bv3].

[BV1] is for breaking down the sump if I ever need to....but [bv2], and [bv3], one will be used to throttle the flow of the pump back into the tank. My question is....which line should I throttle...?

Thanks

Qwiv · 08/22/2006, 02:03 PM

BV3 and you should use a gate valve.

mrichardson · 08/22/2006, 02:05 PM

How would a gate valve allow me to throttle the flow into the tank...all it does is stop back flow.

mrichardson · 08/22/2006, 02:09 PM

Oh, do you mean use a ball valve for throtteling, and a gate valve for backflow...if that's the case where do I put the gate...

1.) between the pump and the ball valve, or

2.) after the ball valve.

Thanks

atvdave · 08/22/2006, 02:12 PM

A ball valve is fine.

The biggest thing to remember is to keep your return line larger that your supply line. Looks like you'll be fine.

You may get some flushing noise from your return, so (if you haven't planed on it all ready) I'd install a Durso pipe, or something similar.

Dave

atvdave · 08/22/2006, 02:15 PM

heck.. I just want to know what program you used to make the drawing.. Look great.

mrichardson · 08/22/2006, 02:20 PM

Smart Draw...it's similar to Microsoft's Visio.

You can get a free demo copy from

http://www.smartdraw.com/exp/sts/home/index.htm

mrichardson · 08/22/2006, 02:25 PM

So, you think all I need on my return to the tank is a ball valve, not a check valve.

Now when you say..

Quote:

The biggest thing to remember is to keep your return line larger that your supply line. Looks like you'll be fine.

Do you mean that....

1.) the supply line into the pump from the sump needs to be bigger than the return line to the tank

or

2.) that the supply into the sump from the overflow needs to be bigger than the return line to the tank from the sump.

Thanks

Qwiv · 08/22/2006, 02:53 PM

A gate valve allows fine control while a ball valve is meant to be on/off. You can use a ball valve to throttle to a point. They can be very difficult to turn after a few years.

A check valve doesn't allow water to flow the other way. Don't use one as they will fail after a few months unless you constantly clean them. Murphy's Law would require the check to work when you haven't cleaned it for a while.

mrichardson · 08/22/2006, 02:57 PM

Ok, now I see the difference...thanks

atvdave · 08/22/2006, 04:31 PM

What I meant by line size was:

The supply line from your pump need to be smaller than the return line going back into your sump.

Why, is so your tank won't over fill. If the return line is larger it will always have a higher GPH flow rate then your supply pump line.

If they where the same size it may work but if maybe a snail or something gets stuck in the return line you may suck your sump dry or over fill your main tank.

And don't use a check valve. I had one on my first tank and it only lasted about a year before it started leaking.

mrichardson · 08/22/2006, 07:12 PM

Gotcha, thanks allot

rickh · 08/23/2006, 04:08 PM

Have the return line come up above the water level so you can drill a siphon break hole. Go up through the bullhead--slightly above the normal running water level--then back under the water to your discharge points. Don't trust check valves to prevent a flood. R

08/22/2006, 11:33 AM	#1
mrichardson Registered Member Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: New Orleans Posts: 64	Plumbing diagram suggestions... Here is the plumbing I am planning for my new 100 gallon. Please advise of any problems you see.

08/22/2006, 11:42 AM	#2
Qwiv Persistant Perspective Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: Belmont, CA Posts: 2,168	Looks fine. I wouldn't reduce the size of your drain line unless you have to. Also look at a Durso or other stand pipe for your overflow. Will quiet it down. It is also a good idea to add a back-up drain, just in case something happens. __________________ If I knew keeping fish would be so hard, I would of had kids by now. Current Tank Info: 50Cube + 250DD + Nano

08/22/2006, 11:56 AM	#3
RichConley Registered Member Join Date: Sep 2004 Location: Bostonian in Chicago going to DC Posts: 9,910	Is the inlet on the GenX 3/4"? If so, reduce as close to the pump as possible. With a long run like that of 3/4, you may very well cavitate the pump. __________________ NO TANKS!!!

08/22/2006, 02:03 PM	#7
Qwiv Persistant Perspective Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: Belmont, CA Posts: 2,168	BV3 and you should use a gate valve. __________________ If I knew keeping fish would be so hard, I would of had kids by now. Current Tank Info: 50Cube + 250DD + Nano

08/22/2006, 02:53 PM	#14
Qwiv Persistant Perspective Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: Belmont, CA Posts: 2,168	A gate valve allows fine control while a ball valve is meant to be on/off. You can use a ball valve to throttle to a point. They can be very difficult to turn after a few years. A check valve doesn't allow water to flow the other way. Don't use one as they will fail after a few months unless you constantly clean them. Murphy's Law would require the check to work when you haven't cleaned it for a while. __________________ If I knew keeping fish would be so hard, I would of had kids by now. Current Tank Info: 50Cube + 250DD + Nano

08/22/2006, 01:06 PM	#4
mrichardson Registered Member Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: New Orleans Posts: 64	The only reason I'm reducing from the overflow box into the sump, is because the sump was designed with a 1 1/4" inlet. I could remove the inlet for the sump, and just have a straight pipe down into the sump, but I figured it would splash too mich.

08/22/2006, 01:34 PM	#6
mrichardson Registered Member Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: New Orleans Posts: 64	Ok, here is a second draft... In particular notice the three ball valves [bv1], [bv2], [bv3]. [BV1] is for breaking down the sump if I ever need to....but [bv2], and [bv3], one will be used to throttle the flow of the pump back into the tank. My question is....which line should I throttle...? Thanks

08/22/2006, 02:05 PM	#8
mrichardson Registered Member Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: New Orleans Posts: 64	How would a gate valve allow me to throttle the flow into the tank...all it does is stop back flow.

08/22/2006, 02:09 PM	#9
mrichardson Registered Member Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: New Orleans Posts: 64	Oh, do you mean use a ball valve for throtteling, and a gate valve for backflow...if that's the case where do I put the gate... 1.) between the pump and the ball valve, or 2.) after the ball valve. Thanks

08/22/2006, 02:12 PM	#10
atvdave Premium Member Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: Newburgh, IN Posts: 1,883	A ball valve is fine. The biggest thing to remember is to keep your return line larger that your supply line. Looks like you'll be fine. You may get some flushing noise from your return, so (if you haven't planed on it all ready) I'd install a Durso pipe, or something similar. Dave

08/22/2006, 02:15 PM	#11
atvdave Premium Member Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: Newburgh, IN Posts: 1,883	heck.. I just want to know what program you used to make the drawing.. Look great.

08/22/2006, 02:20 PM	#12
mrichardson Registered Member Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: New Orleans Posts: 64	Smart Draw...it's similar to Microsoft's Visio. You can get a free demo copy from http://www.smartdraw.com/exp/sts/home/index.htm

08/22/2006, 02:57 PM	#15
mrichardson Registered Member Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: New Orleans Posts: 64	Ok, now I see the difference...thanks

08/22/2006, 04:31 PM	#16
atvdave Premium Member Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: Newburgh, IN Posts: 1,883	What I meant by line size was: The supply line from your pump need to be smaller than the return line going back into your sump. Why, is so your tank won't over fill. If the return line is larger it will always have a higher GPH flow rate then your supply pump line. If they where the same size it may work but if maybe a snail or something gets stuck in the return line you may suck your sump dry or over fill your main tank. And don't use a check valve. I had one on my first tank and it only lasted about a year before it started leaking.

08/22/2006, 07:12 PM	#17
mrichardson Registered Member Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: New Orleans Posts: 64	Gotcha, thanks allot

08/23/2006, 04:08 PM	#18
rickh Registered Member Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: Lost_in_Michigan Posts: 1,306	Have the return line come up above the water level so you can drill a siphon break hole. Go up through the bullhead--slightly above the normal running water level--then back under the water to your discharge points. Don't trust check valves to prevent a flood. R