Montipora dull color but growing

[Tuffloud1]

My montipora has grown considerably over the past 4 months since I got it, but it has become extremely faded, washed out and dull. It was a vibrant red when I first brought it home. I have kept my parameters solid since beginning 2 part dosing a couple months ago, however, the dullness was there before I started dosing.

Currently

1.026 salinity
387 calcium
9 dKH alk
1400 mag
0 nitrate
.02 phosphate (usually undetectable at 0)
77-78 Temp

Any ideas on what the deficiency could be?

[Ratpack]

My first thought is that it is not getting enough food. Like you, I tried to keep my phosphates and nitrates real low and my colors were boring and dull just as you describe. Lots of people suggested feeding more to the tank and since I have done that in the last few weeks, my colors have started to get really nice and vibrant. Just watch to make sure the levels don't go too high and cause algae, but it worked for me.

[tmz]

Hard to tell from the picture. A little more nitrogen might help. Maybe a bit higher PO4. What kind of light is it under? Waht type is it ;capricornus?

[Tuffloud1]

Originally Posted by tmz

Hard to tell from the picture. A little more nitrogen might help. Maybe a bit higher PO4. What kind of light is it under? Waht type is it ;capricornus?

Not sure what kind, It is encrusting to the rock. I have 2 AI Hydra's.

[Tuffloud1]

It looks like this.

[markalot]

Originally Posted by Tuffloud1

My montipora has grown considerably over the past 4 months since I got it, but it has become extremely faded, washed out and dull. It was a vibrant red when I first brought it home. I have kept my parameters solid since beginning 2 part dosing a couple months ago, however, the dullness was there before I started dosing.

Currently

1.026 salinity
387 calcium
9 dKH alk
1400 mag
0 nitrate
.02 phosphate (usually undetectable at 0)
77-78 Temp

Any ideas on what the deficiency could be?

Howdy,

Been there, done that. Might not be the same issue, but here goes in case it helps.

Most likely it's too much light combined with not enough food in the water column. First off, though, can you get your calcium above 400? Do you dose the same amount of each 2 part, minutes or hours apart?

Next up, what kind of lighting are you using? Have you taken PAR readings? Most caps seem to do best right around 200 PAR, more if there are more nutrients in the tank.

When I was running T5's I was able to color up my caps by feeding coral food every other day. I went overboard after months of dull faded corals and set my goals to achieve high phosphates and brown corals, but at least not faded corals. I couldn't do it, all I got was colorful corals and all kinds of funky things growing on the tank walls. It was fun.

Under LED I bleached most of my corals by having the LED's too bright and no amount of feeding could fix it. I bought a PAR meter, measured 500 PAR over one of my bleached corals and adjusted it down so no acro gets more than 300 PAR max. Colors returned over a week or so, but unfortunately the tank looks dimmer than I like. My understanding is this is due to the lack of green light (the light our eyes are most sensitive too) in LED fixtures.

Good luck!

[Tuffloud1]

Originally Posted by markalot

Howdy,

Been there, done that. Might not be the same issue, but here goes in case it helps.

Most likely it's too much light combined with not enough food in the water column. First off, though, can you get your calcium above 400? Do you dose the same amount of each 2 part, minutes or hours apart?

Next up, what kind of lighting are you using? Have you taken PAR readings? Most caps seem to do best right around 200 PAR, more if there are more nutrients in the tank.

When I was running T5's I was able to color up my caps by feeding coral food every other day. I went overboard after months of dull faded corals and set my goals to achieve high phosphates and brown corals, but at least not faded corals. I couldn't do it, all I got was colorful corals and all kinds of funky things growing on the tank walls. It was fun.

Under LED I bleached most of my corals by having the LED's too bright and no amount of feeding could fix it. I bought a PAR meter, measured 500 PAR over one of my bleached corals and adjusted it down so no acro gets more than 300 PAR max. Colors returned over a week or so, but unfortunately the tank looks dimmer than I like. My understanding is this is due to the lack of green light (the light our eyes are most sensitive too) in LED fixtures.

Good luck!

Thanks for the info!

LED's have been very frustrating, some of my sps are doing well, others completely bleached.

Here is a picture of what I have my Hydra's set at, these setting are the same when ramping up and go at 100 percent (meaning royal blue for example actually reaches the 50 setting I have it on) for 6 hours.

Does this seem like too much light? Any feedback is appreciated!

[popsock]

very few Montis do well under very strong lighting, it's most likely to be a lighting issue, move it lower down and give it a month to adapt.

[ECreefer]

^ it could just be getting used to the LED still too. But usually a bleaching/washing out means its getting too much light.

[Tuffloud1]

Originally Posted by ECreefer

^ it could just be getting used to the LED still too. But usually a bleaching/washing out means its getting too much light.

Ya, I just don't get it, really I don't. I am running my Hydra's at a FRACTION of what others are running theirs at.

Some run their blues around 80 some even run everything at 100.

[Reefvet]

Well there you have it. Several replies offering completely conflicting suggestions. Welcome to RC.

You've got a purple cap. One of the easiest corals to grow because it will adapt to a wide range of environment and parameters.

If you have no measurable nitrates or phosphates, and no algae to prove the inaccuracy of your test kits, it's starving. It needs more of everything. Feed your fish more or start feeding the tank, Red Sea Reef Energy works, Two little fishes Acropower works. Pick one method and use it.

I have caps growing in 300-500 par. While they will survive in low light and low flow they love just the opposite.

I got a cap frag from my LFS. It was thin, dark, flat and featureless. It came from a low light, low flow section growing under SOLs. The tank was only fed fish food, no aminos.

I put it into my tank under Kessils running at 100% and providing 400 PAR, with lots of flow. It's now a little lighter in color because it's growing so fast, full of ridges and 4 times as thick. I took a frag of it back to the LFS and they couldn't believe it was the same coral.

FWIW I have many different Montis growing in high flow, high par, high nutrient water. They're all doing great.

[Reefvet]

Originally Posted by Tuffloud1

Ya, I just don't get it, really I don't. I am running my Hydra's at a FRACTION of what others are running theirs at.

Some run their blues around 80 some even run everything at 100.

Have you ever used a PAR meter ?

If not then your settings are just a guess.

Maybe your LFS or a local club has one you could borrow ?

[Tuffloud1]

Originally Posted by Reefvet

Have you ever used a PAR meter ?

If not then your settings are just a guess.

Maybe your LFS or a local club has one you could borrow ?

They might, can I buy one for a reasonable price? If so, where?

[Reefvet]

Originally Posted by popsock

very few Montis do well under very strong lighting, it's most likely to be a lighting issue, move it lower down and give it a month to adapt.

Maybe it's different on that side of the pond (you do drive on the wrong side of the road ) but over here they love strong everything.

I don't have good picture of my purple cap but here's a shot with ORA caps growing (top right) under 450 par and enough flow to make make any SPS happy.

PAR is 250 on the sand and you can see an Orange Setosa, a Sunset Monti and a Purple Haze Monti and they're lovin' life.

[Reefvet]

Originally Posted by Tuffloud1

They might, can I buy one for a reasonable price? If so, where?

The Apogee is $345 on ebay.

[Tuffloud1]

Originally Posted by Reefvet

Maybe it's different on that side of the pond (you do drive on the wrong side of the road ) but over here they love strong everything.

I don't have good picture of my purple cap but here's a shot with ORA caps growing (top right) under 450 par and enough flow to make make any SPS happy.

PAR is 250 on the sand and you can see an Orange Setosa, a Sunset Monti and a Purple Haze Monti and they're lovin' life.

Your tank looks great! What kind of lights are you running? I have the same species Birds Nest that you have on the bottom, but more toward the top of my tank and it has slowly turned from "fluffy" to white with some green polyps barely peaking out. What makes no sense, is I had my Hydra's at the same settings when I got the Birds Nest, it did well for 2 months and actually grew, then all the sudden started bleaching and looking like crap along with some other sps pieces including a bonsai. But another Birds Nest even higher up is thriving and growing. ***!!!

[Reefvet]

Thanks, I do enjoy my little 37 gal grow-out tank.

You're looking at about 18" of the tank's 24" width. I have one Kessil A350W Tuna Blue centered on the tank and 2 Kessil A150 Ocean Blue, one of each side. The A350W is turned all the way up on both channels.

That shot was taken August 1st and everything is much larger now. The green ORA Seritopora has grown nearly 2 inches in 6 weeks. I'm running out of room.

35 ppt
Mag 1600
Alk 9.5
Ca 400

I have no idea what nitrate and phosphates are. They always read 0 so I stopped measuring. The bubble algae proves that test kits don't mean much.

[Tuffloud1]

ReefVet -

Here are some pictures of what is going on.

Here is the Birds Nest that I had at the top portion of the tank but just moved to the bottom to see if it helps it. What does the problem look like to you?

[Tuffloud1]

ReefVet -

Here are some pictures of what is going on.

Here is the Birds Nest that I had at the top portion of the tank but just moved to the bottom to see if it helps it. What does the problem look like to you?

[Tuffloud1]

Here is my bonsai. The frag on the right, I've had for 4 months, the one on the left is from the same colony, but my lfs just fragged it a couple days ago. So for color comparison, you can see how the one in my possession looks like hell. It started out great and started totally encrusting to the rock and sprouting new polyps all over the base, then went to hell.

[Reefvet]

Originally Posted by Tuffloud1

Here are some pictures of what is going on.

Yikes! That's not looking good.

What kind of flow does this tank have ?

The profile in your apex looks like you've got pretty low light levels and a kind of odd mix of the channels. How did you arrive at those settings ?

[Tuffloud1]

Here is a frag that I've had for 4 months, started out doing very well, vibrant yellow, started to encrust to the rock, then turned to absolute crap. All while not changing the Hydra's at all.

[Tuffloud1]

Here is a piece that has been the highest up in the tank out of all the other pieces I have and is growing like crazy, started out as a little "accident" nugget from the lfs, they just gave me it. Dull color but growing like crazy.

[Reefvet]

Originally Posted by Tuffloud1

Here is my bonsai. The frag on the right, I've had for 4 months, the one on the left is from the same colony, but my lfs just fragged it a couple days ago. So for color comparison, you can see how the one in my possession looks like hell.

So what salt are you using and is it mixed with 0 TDS RO/DI ?

[Reefvet]

Originally Posted by Tuffloud1

Here is a frag that I've had for 4 months, started out doing very well, vibrant yellow, started to encrust to the rock, then turned to absolute crap. All while not changing the Hydra's at all.

That's dead or close to it.