2x EDUCTORS & NO MORE POWERHEADS!! - Page 12

hllywd · 07/15/2007, 12:11 PM

I know the power heads are pretty efficient but I'm going to try to run the eductors with a Dolphin AM 3000, the motor is rated at 1.31A. If I get enough flow that way I should come up with a little savings in electric. If not I'll add a couple Koralias or MaxiMods...

You are right these DIYs are about the same size as a MaxiMod. I'm planning to have this assembled and running in a couple weeks (or as soon as I get the pump back from Dolphin with new seals) so we'll see.

Tim

dhnguyen · 07/15/2007, 12:22 PM

Be sure to test out the flow rate increase and let us know

If I'm correct in my calculation 1.31A is about 144.1W at 110V
so that is still quite a power draw IMO.

booker · 07/15/2007, 01:17 PM

In my case the only extra was 7 bucks and a little time. I already have the pump for circulation (panworld 100px-x). The idea here, in my case anyway, is to use the things you already have to increase flow. So the way I look at it, no extra electicity and very little extra cost.

gordie72 · 07/15/2007, 02:21 PM

I want to try these but I'm not sure they are going to work for me as I only have 1/2" return from an Iwaki MD-20R running aroung 420gph. Will there be enough of a change in velocity to drop the pressure if I only have 1/2" pipe returning to the tank? Will it work if I don't bore out the barb id? Should I re-plumb with 3/4" pipe anyway? Thanks for everyone's input

TOYTEK · 07/15/2007, 06:34 PM

I dont know if it will work, but I think Lowes had the 1/2" barb in 1/2" thread too.

ivgonmad · 07/16/2007, 05:12 AM

The whole point about these eductors is to spend $5-$7 and use what you already have. It avoids having to add more power heads that generate extra heat, need regular maintenance, and can even electrocute you or your livestock.

I get enough flow from these eductors that I can skip buying the Tunzes ($$$)

ivgonmad · 07/16/2007, 05:23 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by gordie72
I want to try these but I'm not sure they are going to work for me as I only have 1/2" return from an Iwaki MD-20R running aroung 420gph. Will there be enough of a change in velocity to drop the pressure if I only have 1/2" pipe returning to the tank? Will it work if I don't bore out the barb id? Should I re-plumb with 3/4" pipe anyway? Thanks for everyone's input

That pump might run a single eductor, you might get away with 2 if you use a SCWD in the setup

since it will switch pressure from one to the other instead of splitting it 50/50.

Since it is a pressure rated pump you should probably leave the 1/2" barb un-modified.

You can also use a 3/4" thread to 1/2" adapter to attach them to your current return output.

ivgonmad · 07/16/2007, 05:35 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by booker
In my case the only extra was 7 bucks and a little time. I already have the pump for circulation (panworld 100px-x). The idea here, in my case anyway, is to use the things you already have to increase flow. So the way I look at it, no extra electicity and very little extra cost.

I would do 2 with that pump, to get the most efficiency out of the eductors.

ivgonmad · 07/16/2007, 05:55 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by hllywd
I know the power heads are pretty efficient but I'm going to try to run the eductors with a Dolphin AM 3000, the motor is rated at 1.31A. If I get enough flow that way I should come up with a little savings in electric. If not I'll add a couple Koralias or MaxiMods...

You are right these DIYs are about the same size as a MaxiMod. I'm planning to have this assembled and running in a couple weeks (or as soon as I get the pump back from Dolphin with new seals) so we'll see.

Tim

Thats a big pump

, you will surely get good results!

I would use 3 eductors instead of 4 to cut down on the bulk, 3 might also be better than 4 since they will be more effective with the extra pressure.

ivgonmad · 07/16/2007, 06:13 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by ivgonmad
Thats a big pump , you will surely get good results!

I would use 3 eductors instead of 4 to cut down on the bulk, 3 might also be better than 4 since they will be more effective with the extra pressure.

Have you ever thought of an OM wavemaker? It would be a great complement to your pump and eductors.

BigJPDC · 07/16/2007, 06:26 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by ivgonmad
The whole point about these eductors is to spend $5-$7 and use what you already have. It avoids having to add more power heads that generate extra heat, need regular maintenance, and can even electrocute you or your livestock.

I get enough flow from these eductors that I can skip buying the Tunzes ($$$)

Quote:

Originally posted by booker
In my case the only extra was 7 bucks and a little time. I already have the pump for circulation (panworld 100px-x). The idea here, in my case anyway, is to use the things you already have to increase flow. So the way I look at it, no extra electicity and very little extra cost.

Yep, that's really the point of it for me too. I am only replacing the nozzle on my return plumbing with the my custom shortie eductor, keeping the flow through the sump low while stirring things up greatly in the tank. I was contomplating putting a powerhead in my tank before I found this, and now can stay ph free.

jp

gordie72 · 07/16/2007, 10:14 AM

Thanks guys. I will be putting it together week and will let you know how it goes.

hllywd · 07/16/2007, 12:07 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by ivgonmad
Thats a big pump , you will surely get good results!

I would use 3 eductors instead of 4 to cut down on the bulk, 3 might also be better than 4 since they will be more effective with the extra pressure.

Hmmmm.... Suggesting 3 you made me think about looping the two returns to help equalize the pressure between the two separate 3/4" returns... Nice jog of the though process! I'll plumb it with threaded adapters so it's easy to try 2, 3, or four of them and plug the ones I may not need.

TY,
Tim

hllywd · 07/16/2007, 12:21 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by dhnguyen
Be sure to test out the flow rate increase and let us know

If I'm correct in my calculation 1.31A is about 144.1W at 110V
so that is still quite a power draw IMO.

I'm not sure how I'd really test it other than to observe how vigorously water gets drawn into the holes at the back of the eductor indicationg that it's working...

I agree 144W is a good draw but consider this, a Mag 950 draws the same current for a third of the advertised flow. Also Dolphin says the motor draws less current when it's throttled back which I figure I'll probably have to do since my overflows limit me to about 1200gph. Dolphin suggests that will reduce the current draw to around an amp, of course that's not promised....

Tim

dhnguyen · 07/16/2007, 12:55 PM

Do the bag test to figure out the flow rate. Basically connect a large inflatable bag at the output of the return and timed for some predetermined number of seconds. Then measure the amount of water in the bag. The rest is basic math.

hllywd · 07/16/2007, 01:22 PM

I guess I did see that in the MaxiMod thread. I'll give it a try before I put my rock in, like I stated before my goal is 7/28. That all depends on when I get the pump back with new seals though...

Tim

ivgonmad · 07/19/2007, 01:36 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by hllywd
my overflows limit me to about 1200gph.

what size is you drain piping for the overflow? If you have a 1 1/2" bulkhead you should be able to handle more than 1200 gph.

If what is limiting you is the size of the overflow box, you could always widen the size of the gaps between the teeth or simply remove the teeth and use gutter guard mesh to prevent things from going in the overflow.

This will increase the volume of water the overflow box can handle

hllywd · 07/19/2007, 10:18 AM

I have an AGA 120 Mega Flow tank. Two overflows w/1" drains rated for 600gph each. The bottom is tempered so no way to increase the size. Also I want everything internal so a CL is out at least for now. The current stand is short so it's going to be cramped anyway. A buddy of mine has an 90 with only one drain and returning with a Mag 950 wide open. The 950 data says 800gph @ 4' and he's at about 5'. He also uses two of the Koralias. My hope is that I can have similar flow without the extra stuff in the tank.
I've sorta been looking at an OM Squirt (2 way). Could flow a lot of water on alternating sides that way.... And the price isn't horrible.

Tim

ivgonmad · 07/19/2007, 12:38 PM

that would be awesome, please post pics when you have it done

hllywd · 07/19/2007, 02:56 PM

This is the project: http://reefcentral.com/forums/showth...readid=1163749

Tim

ivgonmad · 07/19/2007, 09:58 PM

thnx

conefree · 07/20/2007, 06:04 AM

Well, finally got around to building my eductors. Quite the improvement I must say! I took out one of my maxi-mods, and I have to say that the corals look much happier now. Thanks Ivan!

BigJPDC · 07/20/2007, 01:54 PM

Nice Conefree!!

therman · 07/20/2007, 09:24 PM

One thing I noticed recently is a fair amount of water is sucked in the front of the eductor and added to the stream, as well as in the holes. Enough that you get little air sucking whirlpools at the front if you have it running close to the surface. This would need to be taken into account of any flow measurements made, and I dont know how you could possibly measure that.

-Tim

ivgonmad · 07/21/2007, 03:34 AM

noticed that too

07/15/2007, 12:11 PM	#276
hllywd Premier World Traveler Join Date: Nov 2000 Location: Ohio Posts: 4,293	I know the power heads are pretty efficient but I'm going to try to run the eductors with a Dolphin AM 3000, the motor is rated at 1.31A. If I get enough flow that way I should come up with a little savings in electric. If not I'll add a couple Koralias or MaxiMods... You are right these DIYs are about the same size as a MaxiMod. I'm planning to have this assembled and running in a couple weeks (or as soon as I get the pump back from Dolphin with new seals) so we'll see. Tim __________________ "The moment you doubt whether you can fly, you cease forever to be able to do it..." J.M. Barrie Current Tank Info: 210 AGA RR, Apex, 3x Kessil A360W & 2x 80W T5s, GEO 618 Ca Rx, BM220 CS2 skimmer, Tunze 6100s, 42" ETSS/AE Tech refugium/sump

07/15/2007, 02:21 PM	#279
gordie72 Registered Member Join Date: May 2003 Location: South Carolina Posts: 90	I want to try these but I'm not sure they are going to work for me as I only have 1/2" return from an Iwaki MD-20R running aroung 420gph. Will there be enough of a change in velocity to drop the pressure if I only have 1/2" pipe returning to the tank? Will it work if I don't bore out the barb id? Should I re-plumb with 3/4" pipe anyway? Thanks for everyone's input __________________ Alex: I would have accepted bow wow or ruff. Sean: Oh, ruff Trebek. Just the way your mother likes it. Current Tank Info: 75 mixed reef, 20gal sump/refugium, 6 bulb T5

07/15/2007, 06:34 PM	#280
TOYTEK Registered Member Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: Hueytown(Birmingham), AL Posts: 250	I dont know if it will work, but I think Lowes had the 1/2" barb in 1/2" thread too. __________________ --Danny Current Tank Info: 55 Gallon

07/16/2007, 05:12 AM	#281
ivgonmad Registered Member Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: San Diego Posts: 468	The whole point about these eductors is to spend $5-$7 and use what you already have. It avoids having to add more power heads that generate extra heat, need regular maintenance, and can even electrocute you or your livestock. I get enough flow from these eductors that I can skip buying the Tunzes ($$$) __________________ 60g Frag Tank 60g Q.T. 240g Reef - 2x Dual 250w Coralvue MH Ballasts, 2x Custom Dual 250w Pendants, DAS EX-3 Protein Skimmer, GEN-X PCX-40 Return Pump, Iwaki 70 Closed Loop, Wave I Closed Loop, 4x Pacific Coast Flow Accelerators, GEO 612 Calcium Reactor w/Panworld Pump, 75g SDA Sump/Refugium, Fluorex 65w Floodlight Refugium Light Current Tank Info: 240g in the works B) Last edited by ivgonmad; 07/16/2007 at 05:36 AM.

07/16/2007, 10:14 AM	#287
gordie72 Registered Member Join Date: May 2003 Location: South Carolina Posts: 90	Thanks guys. I will be putting it together week and will let you know how it goes. __________________ Alex: I would have accepted bow wow or ruff. Sean: Oh, ruff Trebek. Just the way your mother likes it. Current Tank Info: 75 mixed reef, 20gal sump/refugium, 6 bulb T5

07/15/2007, 12:22 PM	#277
dhnguyen Moved On Join Date: May 2004 Location: Kingston, WA Posts: 4,751	Be sure to test out the flow rate increase and let us know If I'm correct in my calculation 1.31A is about 144.1W at 110V so that is still quite a power draw IMO.

07/15/2007, 01:17 PM	#278
booker Registered Member Join Date: May 2007 Posts: 31	In my case the only extra was 7 bucks and a little time. I already have the pump for circulation (panworld 100px-x). The idea here, in my case anyway, is to use the things you already have to increase flow. So the way I look at it, no extra electicity and very little extra cost.

07/16/2007, 12:55 PM	#290
dhnguyen Moved On Join Date: May 2004 Location: Kingston, WA Posts: 4,751	Do the bag test to figure out the flow rate. Basically connect a large inflatable bag at the output of the return and timed for some predetermined number of seconds. Then measure the amount of water in the bag. The rest is basic math.

07/16/2007, 01:22 PM	#291
hllywd Premier World Traveler Join Date: Nov 2000 Location: Ohio Posts: 4,293	I guess I did see that in the MaxiMod thread. I'll give it a try before I put my rock in, like I stated before my goal is 7/28. That all depends on when I get the pump back with new seals though... Tim __________________ "The moment you doubt whether you can fly, you cease forever to be able to do it..." J.M. Barrie Current Tank Info: 210 AGA RR, Apex, 3x Kessil A360W & 2x 80W T5s, GEO 618 Ca Rx, BM220 CS2 skimmer, Tunze 6100s, 42" ETSS/AE Tech refugium/sump

07/19/2007, 10:18 AM	#293
hllywd Premier World Traveler Join Date: Nov 2000 Location: Ohio Posts: 4,293	I have an AGA 120 Mega Flow tank. Two overflows w/1" drains rated for 600gph each. The bottom is tempered so no way to increase the size. Also I want everything internal so a CL is out at least for now. The current stand is short so it's going to be cramped anyway. A buddy of mine has an 90 with only one drain and returning with a Mag 950 wide open. The 950 data says 800gph @ 4' and he's at about 5'. He also uses two of the Koralias. My hope is that I can have similar flow without the extra stuff in the tank. I've sorta been looking at an OM Squirt (2 way). Could flow a lot of water on alternating sides that way.... And the price isn't horrible. Tim __________________ "The moment you doubt whether you can fly, you cease forever to be able to do it..." J.M. Barrie Current Tank Info: 210 AGA RR, Apex, 3x Kessil A360W & 2x 80W T5s, GEO 618 Ca Rx, BM220 CS2 skimmer, Tunze 6100s, 42" ETSS/AE Tech refugium/sump

07/19/2007, 12:38 PM	#294
ivgonmad Registered Member Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: San Diego Posts: 468	that would be awesome, please post pics when you have it done __________________ 60g Frag Tank 60g Q.T. 240g Reef - 2x Dual 250w Coralvue MH Ballasts, 2x Custom Dual 250w Pendants, DAS EX-3 Protein Skimmer, GEN-X PCX-40 Return Pump, Iwaki 70 Closed Loop, Wave I Closed Loop, 4x Pacific Coast Flow Accelerators, GEO 612 Calcium Reactor w/Panworld Pump, 75g SDA Sump/Refugium, Fluorex 65w Floodlight Refugium Light Current Tank Info: 240g in the works B)

07/19/2007, 02:56 PM	#295
hllywd Premier World Traveler Join Date: Nov 2000 Location: Ohio Posts: 4,293	This is the project: http://reefcentral.com/forums/showth...readid=1163749 Tim __________________ "The moment you doubt whether you can fly, you cease forever to be able to do it..." J.M. Barrie Current Tank Info: 210 AGA RR, Apex, 3x Kessil A360W & 2x 80W T5s, GEO 618 Ca Rx, BM220 CS2 skimmer, Tunze 6100s, 42" ETSS/AE Tech refugium/sump

07/19/2007, 09:58 PM	#296
ivgonmad Registered Member Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: San Diego Posts: 468	thnx __________________ 60g Frag Tank 60g Q.T. 240g Reef - 2x Dual 250w Coralvue MH Ballasts, 2x Custom Dual 250w Pendants, DAS EX-3 Protein Skimmer, GEN-X PCX-40 Return Pump, Iwaki 70 Closed Loop, Wave I Closed Loop, 4x Pacific Coast Flow Accelerators, GEO 612 Calcium Reactor w/Panworld Pump, 75g SDA Sump/Refugium, Fluorex 65w Floodlight Refugium Light Current Tank Info: 240g in the works B)

07/20/2007, 06:04 AM	#297
conefree Gene Pool Lifeguard Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: Downingtown, PA Posts: 758	Well, finally got around to building my eductors. Quite the improvement I must say! I took out one of my maxi-mods, and I have to say that the corals look much happier now. Thanks Ivan! __________________ Chris "A Closed Mouth Gathers No Foot" - Unknown Some people are like Slinkies . . . not really good for anything, but you still can't help but smile when you see one tumble down the stairs. Current Tank Info: 120 gallon, Ecosystem 3612, 6X54 TEK light, Tunze Osmolator, Lifereef dual overflow all down

07/20/2007, 01:54 PM	#298
BigJPDC Registered Member Join Date: Oct 2005 Location: Northern Virginia Posts: 959	Nice Conefree!! __________________ Rock in the tank is money not in my bank. Current Tank Info: 65 RR AGA

07/20/2007, 09:24 PM	#299
therman biodiversity enthusiast Join Date: Apr 2000 Location: Whitehouse, OH, USA Posts: 1,107	One thing I noticed recently is a fair amount of water is sucked in the front of the eductor and added to the stream, as well as in the holes. Enough that you get little air sucking whirlpools at the front if you have it running close to the surface. This would need to be taken into account of any flow measurements made, and I dont know how you could possibly measure that. -Tim __________________ October 2001 TOTM Current Tank Info: 65g mixed display 100g rubbermaid sump/prop tank, 20g refugium, 100g half cube rimless acro display, 3x 100-180g prop tanks. All powered by LED.

07/21/2007, 03:34 AM	#300
ivgonmad Registered Member Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: San Diego Posts: 468	noticed that too __________________ 60g Frag Tank 60g Q.T. 240g Reef - 2x Dual 250w Coralvue MH Ballasts, 2x Custom Dual 250w Pendants, DAS EX-3 Protein Skimmer, GEN-X PCX-40 Return Pump, Iwaki 70 Closed Loop, Wave I Closed Loop, 4x Pacific Coast Flow Accelerators, GEO 612 Calcium Reactor w/Panworld Pump, 75g SDA Sump/Refugium, Fluorex 65w Floodlight Refugium Light Current Tank Info: 240g in the works B)