Eric's "famous" coral food recipe

[EricHugo]

Growth - almost has to be. but this is off topic...if you want to ask more questions like these, let's start a new thread.

[David_Winther]

Eric,

What would you expect the shelf life on your mush to be if it was kept in the freezer?

Also, if I have a bottle of DT's in the fridge, how long does it stay good?

The reason I ask is that I am in the Navy and tend to go on "trips" every now and then and it would be great if I could leave the wife a 6 month supply of food without her having to worry about brewing her own or going to the LFS to buy whatever they happen to have on hand.

Thanks!

-David Winther
Oak Harbor, WA

[SawCJack00]

Blue Lagoon, actually I have used the gel cap form of garlic extract, but using garlic cloves is much easier. You simply drop a couple into the blender, and trust me, the blender has no problem with them. The mixing is just as thorough as with the garlic extract.

[EricHugo]

In the freezer, darn near forever...on DT's - I would contact Dennis Tagrin and ask him...not my product, you know?

[got chow]

Interesting recipe... Just caught this thread. I might end up trying it. I'll have to make sure my roomate and I take a 2 week vacation afterwards though. I don't think I can handle the smell and I'm damn sure he can't!!!

BTW Eric, how does your kitchen smell???

[EricHugo]

Badly when I make this food.

Wonderful otherwise. I like to cook

[sh8g8delik]

I was wondering eric, because this recipe sounds sooo complicated but clearly articulated, i was wondering for like the people who dont have time or the resources to make this scrumptious feast for the corals and inverterbrates, if you were willing to make batch or so with the intentions of selling it. I'm sure there are many of us out there very intrigued by your recipe and would be willing to pay for it if you were to sell it, i would pay any price for it because im a full time college student and dont really have the time or the store to nearby to buy all these sophisticated ingredients to make such a treat. Just thought i try

[EricHugo]

LOL - well, no one has ever asked me that before.

I don't think it would travel very well, nor could we probably afford frozen transport.

Also, I have neither time, desire, nor inclination to sell or market any aquarium products (except me words).

Besides, I'd be breaking a promise to someone I made a long time ago.

He told, if you want te keep your credibility, you can't sell things. He owned a store, and knew firsthand how knowledge, even if real and honest like his, becomes skewed or perceived to be skewed the minute you add money into the equation.

He was right. I think we can all name others who fit that bill, too.

I have never forgotten that and I never will.

But thanks for asking!

[sh8g8delik]

Never really thought about that, very thoughtful words. Thank you for replying though, i kinda figured itd be too much trouble, but your words are already valuble so that if you were ever able to sell your knowledge you be a millionaire. Just thought id show appreciation and acknowledge your helpful nature.

[ToiletTank13]

Eric,

I asked this in a pm but for the benefit of others here I'll post it again:

In using all the fresh clams, mussels, oysters etc., do you at all feel you are adding a substantial amount of metals into the tank?

I read somewhere out there about the high levels of certain metals in the clams, oysters & mussels you use in your recipe and was wondering if any testing was ever done on any of the molluscs included in the recipe?

I'll find the research on the topic of metals in these kinds of animals and post it if you feel it's at all relevant.

Thanks bud.

[Nitro Joe]

I am new to the salt world. I am having a great deal of fun, but I am truly green. If you wouldn't mind answering a couple, hopefully simple questions for me please Eric.

My tanks are new, but cycling nicely. There is, in both tanks, some fairly significant cyano growth (...I'm not talking small patches, but covering whole rocks, and slowly the entire surface of the gravel) and I was wondering about the phosphates in the frozen brine and Nutramin dry pellets I'm using now perhaps encouraging growth of such nuisances. A nice fellow referred me to your recipe here in this string http://www.nano-reef.com/forums/show...5042#post95042. Is this recipe low in phosphates? Does anything besides cyanobacteria thrive on/ or need phosphates? Am I sweating "the small stuff" here?

A few specific questions I have are:
#1. What are DT's?
#2. What is the "roe" of something? ...entrails?
#3. What are Echinacea capsules?
#4. Is Super Selco a name brand of vitamin supplement?
#5. Who makes Golden Pearls?

Certainly I am interested in feeding all my lovely little creatures a well-balanced diet, so your recipe is intriguing and I think I will give it a go. Thanks in advance.

Joe.

[ToiletTank13]

I'm definitely not the expert Eric is Joe,

But:

1. DT's are a brand of live phytoplankton used as food for certain corals, zooplankton and the small critters in a deep sand bed.

2. I believe "roe" is the eggs from a particular animal, such as fish "roe" is the eggs or entire egg sac from the female.

3. Echinacea is a commonly used herb by humans to increase bodily resistance to infection, or for "boils".

4. Super Selco is SUPER Self Emulisified Liquid Concentrate, the original being developed by Artemia Systems. It's commonly used as an enrichment for Artemia or rotifers. Most here use it in conjunction with coral feedings or an additive to their recipes.

5. Golden Pearls is manufactured by Tesgofarm Aqua.

For professional advice, Eric is the man!

Good luck.

[michaelg]

1. DTs is phytoplankton. bottom of the food chain.
2. Roe is an oriental? term referring to fish eggs. These vary in size depending on the fish they come from. Used in sushi.
3. Enichea is a terrestrial plant, the capsules you can find in a drug or health food store in the suppliments.
4. Super selco is super concentrated selcon. It is a vitamin/fatty acid suppliment in the aquarium trade.
5. Golden pearls are made by Brine Shrimp Direct.

[EricHugo]

See above for answers:

As to the bioaccumulation aspect, yes, I have though of that and given it some thought, but I have no data to support it one way or the other. All in all, my rationale is that its a human food source and some measure of testing has to go on to ensure that various beds are currently safe and probably not from polluted areas or that they are farm raised.

[EdKruzel]

Hello Eric (& All),
Interesting thread. I have been using a similar (not quite so complex) mixture for some time.

I find in feeding such a variety I can easily feed a greater amount being it caters to a greater diversity of life.

As to the garlic extract; I have used garlic in the past without observing any adverse effects, however I read some recent studies that it may have some negative attributes in the marine world.

I stopped using it long before this study simply because it had no bearing in my system.
In a low to stress free environment with a healthy variety of foods; fish have more than an ample immune system in defending against common parasites.

I have yet to witness a mature tank break out in a parasitic infection without a noticeable cause (poor diet, sudden stress from equipment failure, poor containment bioload...).
Fix the cause of the stress, and ensure a proper diet and parasites vanish.

I'll add a few of Eric's ingredients to my own in my next batch.

Take Care,
Ed

[Nitro Joe]

Michael and ToiletTank,

Thanks for answering my specific questions. Where are these DT's purchased? I live in a ho-dunk town with sparse aquarium resources, so I often need to buy online.


Eric,

How about the phosphates in the aquarium system? Has that question been answered?

[ToiletTank13]

I buy DT's locally for 17.99 a 15oz bottle. Most of the larger web vendors sell DT's, it's the shipping that kills ya! They have to be kept cold AND shipped ASAP. So you're better off stocking up on whatever you need in the way of livestock or coral and have it shipped with the load so the shipping is spread out more and the only real cost of the DT's is keeping them cold.

Good luck, we all need it!

[ToiletTank13]

BTW, I'm gonna find that info on metals & molluscs and post a small bit on the numbers when I can.

If you have the time to let us know of your opinion on the levels found in the samples, I know I'd appreciate the insight.

[Caribbean Soul]

I didn't find much info on daphnia in the forum. Brine Shrimp Direct is having a free shipping special on 2# of frozen. Would this be a good food source? Alternative to brine shrimp?

Thanks

[michaelg]

It's kind of big for corals imo, though am sure it would fit fine for some. There is a jarred product called "sweetwater zooplankton" that I have used in the past, and the fish seem to like it. It is sold in a fresh water and salt water variety, though I have no idea what the difference is...... Definately larger than baby brine shrimp, maybe about the same as adult brine??

[2socrates]

These are non-issues. All the big issues, at least in my mind, have very little thought paid to them, and relatively poor solutions available.

Eric,

This should probably be in anther thread, but, I was wondering what you thought the big issues are.

[revjlw]

Where does everybody buy the non-grocery items? I do not have access to an LFS without a substaintial drive. Do you all mail order some of the stuff? Recommendations about where to do so? Also, what are reasonable prices on the various things? Is the tahitian blend the paste available through Brine Shrimp Direct and is that where you all get the Pearls and do you get all 7 sizes? Inquiring minds and all that....

[michaelg]

Outside of the "normal" grocery store, one of the best places is a good oriental market.

Here are a list of mail order places. I found all of them to be reasonably priced.
Selco can be found through most mail order places as can DTs phytoplankton. Shipping isn't bad on dry products, some liquids and definately frozen need to be shipped in a timely manner though. Jemco is on the east coast so they were able to ship standard UPS to my area and it came overnight (about $8 for a BIG order of stuff).

http://www.jehmco.com/PRODUCTS_/FISH...clop-eeze.html -cyclopeeze and mysis shrimp among other things. Frozen and dried.
Jemco sells in large quantities only, but still not expensive for what you get.

http://www.florida-aqua-farms.com/ - great for culture supplies

http://aquaculturestore.com/swinverts.html - some unique items for live cultures

www.aquaticeco.com - all around good place with a decent variety of items

www.brineshrimpdirect.com - was supplier of golden pearls, also spirulina powder, brine shrimp eggs, etc. Not sure on their status though......

www.instantalgae.com - supplier of "tahitian blend" and other concentrated algae pastes.

I'm sure there are others I have forgotten. Many of these I found through discussions with fish breeders, as they have been doing the live culturing and feeding little mouths for a while now

[revjlw]

Eric,
1. Are the percentages based on volume or weight in this recipe?
2. Can you get Golden Pearls anywhere besides BrineShrimpDirect?
3. Are REALLY big Krill and silversides okay for the fish part if I still add mussels and the like?
4. Where do you find roe? I've looked all over the nearest big city. I can find caviar - NO WAY - and I've checked the Asian markets we have - Hmong, not Japanese.
5. I found DTs at the nearest LFS, but it is $12 for 3.5 oz - isn't that a lot?

Sugestions? Thanks

[michaelg]

aquatic eco did have golden pearls and some similar products listed in their printed catalog. Might try there.

The roe I pick up at a korean market, though all the other oriental markets around me have it as well (but we have a fairly large oriental population in this area). I find it over in a cooler in the fish department. Orange round eggs in a plastic deli container. It is fresh, not preserved.

If I had to buy DT's, it wouldn't go into my food mix. I use nanochloropsis that I culture, so cost is minimal (about $0.50/liter ?) You might check some mail order places for DT's and compare prices. Keep in mind that the stuff is pretty sensative to heat, and doesn't keep long. By 6 months or so, it is shot (from a study Rob Toonen did a couple years back).

I would think Krill would be a great substitute for shrimp. Silversides for the fish portion......

One thing to keep in mind- one of the benefits of making your own mix (aside from knowing what is going in your tank and custom tailoring it) is the cost savings. If you have plenty of the krill and silversides and need to use it up, then by all means do. Otherwise, just get stuff at the store. I have estimated cost of making food to be about $12 for a full blender. That is a whole lot of food. I give away 5 baggies and keep 3, but my system is on the small side. I usually make it quarterly and take some of it my local clubs meetings to share.

No 2 batches ever come out exactly the same, but it is nothing to fret over.