New Reef - Orchid Dottyback Ich + Fon Rot?

kiMxD · 02/11/2018, 11:15 AM

Hello Guys!

I am new to this forum, for couple weeks I've been reading topics here but today I've decided to join the community because I have a problem.

I have an orchid dottyback in my 75g reef tank along with 4 blue danzels, 1 three stripe danzel, 1 goby firefish, 1 Lawnmower Orange Spotted and a yellow tang. My dottyback has ich, which I've been treating the water and the food (in the whole DT) with metroplex + focus for 4 days now. But, recently I realized he might have contracted fin rot as well, so last night I've started treating the whole DT with KanaPlex as well.

Before you tell me that, I'd like to say that I heard from different sources/LFS's that they treat their systems as a whole, instead of quarantining sick fish, reason why I've decided to do the same.

My questions are:
1-) do you think the way I am treating my system (the dottyback is the only one visibly sick so far) in an effective way?

2-) should I keep this treatment?

3-) are there any other type of drugs (reef safe) that you'd suggest?

Some useful information (please don't judge my lack of patience):
Reef tank set up: 4 weeks ago;
75 gallons;
40 gallons sump with skimmer and refugium for copepods;
2 hydras 600gph pumps;
Ammonia levels at 0 and nitrite at very low percentage (don't remember now);
Using Stability EVERYDAY since the tank was set up (at the first week I've used Prime as well);

Useful information about the dottyback:
He has been eating (as well the rest of the fish) the treated food normally, no signs of rejection at all, he loves it (mix of brine shrimp, flakes, spirulina and mysis shrimp);

His belly is in good shape, doesnt look bloated neither skinny;

He does scratches himself against the substrate/rock/shells SOMETIMES, this is getting better after I started the treatment...

Sorry for the long post, I appreciate your help!

whosurcaddie · 02/12/2018, 03:19 AM

Fish stores treat their systems as a whole because they don't hang on to fish long enough to go through a proper quarantine procedure.

To be blunt, no, the way you're treating the system will not help solve Ich. Fin rot I'm not sure about I've never had to deal with it, it doesn't matter anyways you are going to need to remove all the fish anyway and do a proper quarantine.

All your fish have to be treated as if they have ich now even though they may not be showing signs. The reason why is you have to understand the life cycle of ich.

I'm not explaining all that. Some very good reading here as well as quarantine procedures.
http://www.reefkeeping.com/issues/2003-08/sp/index.php

Don't dose any other drugs to your system it's not going to work. Good luck!

kiMxD · 02/12/2018, 07:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by whosurcaddie

Fish stores treat their systems as a whole because they don't hang on to fish long enough to go through a proper quarantine procedure.

To be blunt, no, the way you're treating the system will not help solve Ich. Fin rot I'm not sure about I've never had to deal with it, it doesn't matter anyways you are going to need to remove all the fish anyway and do a proper quarantine.

All your fish have to be treated as if they have ich now even though they may not be showing signs. The reason why is you have to understand the life cycle of ich.

I'm not explaining all that. Some very good reading here as well as quarantine procedures.
http://www.reefkeeping.com/issues/2003-08/sp/index.php

Don't dose any other drugs to your system it's not going to work. Good luck!

Thank you whosurcaddie!

Last night I took my DT apart and grabbed all my fish and put them into a QT/Hospital 20g long tank. It's a bit overcrowded (4 danzels, 1 orchid dottyback, 1 firefish, 1 orange spotted blenny, 1 hawaiian zebra blenny and 1 yellow tank) but they're all small and I will give the danzels tonight to my LFS (I had them just to help cycle the tank).

I treated the water of this new QT/Hospital tank with metroplex prior to adding the fish to it, just in case. But I am really interested in starting a cupramine treatment tonight, what are your thoughts on that guys?

Also, I had a plastic tank decoration that I wasn't using and I've added it to the QT tank to give the fish some place to hide, should I remove it and leave the QT completely bare?

Please, give me any tips you might have, specially if you think that my fish (the ones listed above) will most likely survive to a copper treatment or not. I really appreciate any help, never had a hospital tank before...

Thank you!

bertoni · 02/12/2018, 07:36 PM

Giving the fish a place to hide is fine. I don't know what fish will survive copper, though. I'd check on the blenny fishes. The tang, dottyback, damsels, and firefish should be fine. Personally, I'd consider the tank transfer method:

http://reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=2388428

kiMxD · 02/13/2018, 12:27 PM

Thank you bertoni!

Uncle99 · 02/13/2018, 12:52 PM

Never used cupramine on a blen, so not sure, but always good outcome with the others.
If you use, make sure not to overdose, that of course will kill them including the parasite.
Keep ammonia in check.
Also good outcome with HYPO, never tried the TTM, hopefully never again.
Years ago now, when the stress was removed and the food quality increased and varied, never had this problem ever again. Good luck

Fnic99 · 02/16/2018, 05:11 PM

I used cupermine on a Blenny once and didn’t go well. Started breathing real heavy and I took him right out. Everything else was fine. I read after that Blennies can’t take any copper but are somehow resistant to ich. Not sure if true. Maybe someone can confirm.

Sk8r · 02/16/2018, 05:19 PM

Resistant but not immune, especially in bad water conditions like low alkalinity. Check the alk in the problem tank: if it's not between 7.9 and 9.0, it's one of the problems. Overcrowding is also an issue, but I'm suspecting no-quarantine and a water-quality issue. Treating the display tank is going to harm the cycled system while doing nothing to stop the ich.

02/11/2018, 11:15 AM	#1
kiMxD Registered Member Join Date: Feb 2018 Posts: 149	New Reef - Orchid Dottyback Ich + Fon Rot? Hello Guys! I am new to this forum, for couple weeks I've been reading topics here but today I've decided to join the community because I have a problem. I have an orchid dottyback in my 75g reef tank along with 4 blue danzels, 1 three stripe danzel, 1 goby firefish, 1 Lawnmower Orange Spotted and a yellow tang. My dottyback has ich, which I've been treating the water and the food (in the whole DT) with metroplex + focus for 4 days now. But, recently I realized he might have contracted fin rot as well, so last night I've started treating the whole DT with KanaPlex as well. Before you tell me that, I'd like to say that I heard from different sources/LFS's that they treat their systems as a whole, instead of quarantining sick fish, reason why I've decided to do the same. My questions are: 1-) do you think the way I am treating my system (the dottyback is the only one visibly sick so far) in an effective way? 2-) should I keep this treatment? 3-) are there any other type of drugs (reef safe) that you'd suggest? Some useful information (please don't judge my lack of patience): Reef tank set up: 4 weeks ago; 75 gallons; 40 gallons sump with skimmer and refugium for copepods; 2 hydras 600gph pumps; Ammonia levels at 0 and nitrite at very low percentage (don't remember now); Using Stability EVERYDAY since the tank was set up (at the first week I've used Prime as well); Useful information about the dottyback: He has been eating (as well the rest of the fish) the treated food normally, no signs of rejection at all, he loves it (mix of brine shrimp, flakes, spirulina and mysis shrimp); His belly is in good shape, doesnt look bloated neither skinny; He does scratches himself against the substrate/rock/shells SOMETIMES, this is getting better after I started the treatment... Sorry for the long post, I appreciate your help!

02/12/2018, 07:36 PM	#4
bertoni RC Mod Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Mountain View, CA, USA Posts: 88,616	Giving the fish a place to hide is fine. I don't know what fish will survive copper, though. I'd check on the blenny fishes. The tang, dottyback, damsels, and firefish should be fine. Personally, I'd consider the tank transfer method: http://reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=2388428 __________________ Jonathan Bertoni

02/16/2018, 05:19 PM	#8
Sk8r RC Mod Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: Spokane WA Posts: 34,628 Blog Entries: 55	Resistant but not immune, especially in bad water conditions like low alkalinity. Check the alk in the problem tank: if it's not between 7.9 and 9.0, it's one of the problems. Overcrowding is also an issue, but I'm suspecting no-quarantine and a water-quality issue. Treating the display tank is going to harm the cycled system while doing nothing to stop the ich. __________________ Sk8r Salinity 1.024-6; alkalinity 8.3-9.3 on KH scale; calcium 420; magnesium 1300, temp 78-80, nitrate .2. Ammonia 0. No filters: lps tank. Alk and cal won't rise if mg is low. Current Tank Info: 105g AquaVim wedge, yellow tang, sailfin blenny,royal gramma, ocellaris clown pair, yellow watchman, 100 microceriths, 25 tiny hermits, a 4" conch, 1" nassarius, recovering from 2 year hiatus with daily water change of 10%.

02/12/2018, 03:19 AM	#2
whosurcaddie Registered Member Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 2,354	Fish stores treat their systems as a whole because they don't hang on to fish long enough to go through a proper quarantine procedure. To be blunt, no, the way you're treating the system will not help solve Ich. Fin rot I'm not sure about I've never had to deal with it, it doesn't matter anyways you are going to need to remove all the fish anyway and do a proper quarantine. All your fish have to be treated as if they have ich now even though they may not be showing signs. The reason why is you have to understand the life cycle of ich. I'm not explaining all that. Some very good reading here as well as quarantine procedures. http://www.reefkeeping.com/issues/2003-08/sp/index.php Don't dose any other drugs to your system it's not going to work. Good luck!

02/13/2018, 12:27 PM	#5
kiMxD Registered Member Join Date: Feb 2018 Posts: 149	Thank you bertoni!

02/13/2018, 12:52 PM	#6
Uncle99 Crab Free Zone Join Date: Sep 2017 Location: Ontario, Canada Posts: 2,906	Never used cupramine on a blen, so not sure, but always good outcome with the others. If you use, make sure not to overdose, that of course will kill them including the parasite. Keep ammonia in check. Also good outcome with HYPO, never tried the TTM, hopefully never again. Years ago now, when the stress was removed and the food quality increased and varied, never had this problem ever again. Good luck

02/16/2018, 05:11 PM	#7
Fnic99 Registered Member Join Date: Aug 2016 Posts: 51	I used cupermine on a Blenny once and didn’t go well. Started breathing real heavy and I took him right out. Everything else was fine. I read after that Blennies can’t take any copper but are somehow resistant to ich. Not sure if true. Maybe someone can confirm.