Algae Scrubber Basics

[BluScrnOdeth]

ok, well got the scrubber scrubbed and new lights up. I took one of them down so you could see the screen better.



it was Cyno BTW. Ugh, didnt seem like it at first but then i found a bloom of it in my tank, took it out, compared, and yeah, same thing... Hopefully the better lighting will take care of things.

[srusso]

Originally Posted by BluScrnOdeth

ok, well got the scrubber scrubbed and new lights up. I took one of them down so you could see the screen better.



it was Cyno BTW. Ugh, didnt seem like it at first but then i found a bloom of it in my tank, took it out, compared, and yeah, same thing... Hopefully the better lighting will take care of things.

Placement of the lights looks good. The last thing I would say you need is to get some plastic canvas that we spoke about before and your build will be complete. This screen you used will probably work in the very short term, but you will need something you can rough up at least in the next week or so. Good work, now go do your homework! Lol hahaha

[BluScrnOdeth]

you ever notice that under everyones tank, it looks like a train wreck. And i thought that mine looked pretty clean until i saw the picture i took.... must at 10lbs as they say. I was thinking about seeing how well this screen does. I have used it for a year and never got over 1" thick algae, and it held to the screen. But i was using 5k light back then and now im using 2700. I'll keep an eye on it to see if the longer algae breaks away from the screen and if so then ill make the 1.5hr trip to Hobby Lobby. I was going to go there next weekend but plans changed (wifes birthday plans changed)...

[srusso]

Totally know what your talking about with the sump pictures. In person my sump looks a little messy. But in that picture I put on the first page... Wow! Makes me look like I don't care for the tank at all!! As so for the screen try what you have but suspect it to be the problem if you ever have an issue.

[SSpiro]

[BluScrnOdeth]

Hey SSpiro, are you supposed to be using the entire screen for scrubbing? If so you might want to use another light or put one in the back to compensate for the lack of growth on the bottom that will get very little light. Or get two of them and angle one down for the bottom. Algae outside of 6" of direct light from my experience doesnt grow all that well.

SRUSSO
With roughing up that plastic canvas, could you just use some really coarse sand paper. Seems like it would be easier. Use some 80 grit or something on a sander. Takes out a lot of manual labor. Not sure if it would just eat up the canvas though. Have you tried that?

Oh and i should mention that my screen is double layered. I figured with it being double layered that it would help the algae catch on. maybe thats why it has been working with some pretty good success, just needed proper lighting to go along with it. The true test is when i start getting a mullet growing on there and seeing if the algae keeps hold.

[srusso]

Originally Posted by SSpiro

Light is a bit too close, should be 4 inches away, it looks to be almost touching the screen in that pix. Also need another bulb. As BSOD said you will get little to no growth at the bottom. Very important if your running only a single side. I would also recommend using spiral CFLs.

[srusso]

Originally Posted by BluScrnOdeth

SRUSSO
With roughing up that plastic canvas, could you just use some really coarse sand paper. Seems like it would be easier. Use some 80 grit or something on a sander. Takes out a lot of manual labor. Not sure if it would just eat up the canvas though. Have you tried that?

Oh and i should mention that my screen is double layered. I figured with it being double layered that it would help the algae catch on. maybe thats why it has been working with some pretty good success, just needed proper lighting to go along with it. The true test is when i start getting a mullet growing on there and seeing if the algae keeps hold.

Sand paper will not work... sorry. The hole saw will create spurs or spikes. The sand paper will just effectively thin the screen out. This is a very important part of creating a working scrubber screen.

Good luck with the screen material, hope it works out for you. However it maybe easier just to get whats tested and working... In fact window screen was one of the first screen types to be used and it was discovered to be unfit for the algae scrubbers needs. I will dig up the research on it for you.

[srusso]

Tonight was harvest night! Doubling my lighting doubled my harvest!! So happy with my additional lighting!!!

[SSpiro]

Originally Posted by srusso

Light is a bit too close, should be 4 inches away, it looks to be almost touching the screen in that pix. Also need another bulb. As BSOD said you will get little to no growth at the bottom. Very important if your running only a single side. I would also recommend using spiral CFLs.

Should have taken updated pics, these pics are actually old at this point.

• Light is a CFL. It's just in a floodlight style housing, complete with internal reflector.
• Light has been moved 4-5 inches away already, as I already had experienced algae burning off in the middle closest to the lamp.
• I can not fit a lamp on the backside of the scrubber. Just no room, so i don't have any options here
• Although I had roughed up the screen simply by using very coarse sandpaper, seems to be doing just fine. I'll have my first harvest tonight.

[BluScrnOdeth]

Originally Posted by srusso

Sand paper will not work... sorry. The hole saw will create spurs or spikes. The sand paper will just effectively thin the screen out. This is a very important part of creating a working scrubber screen.

Good luck with the screen material, hope it works out for you. However it maybe easier just to get whats tested and working... In fact window screen was one of the first screen types to be used and it was discovered to be unfit for the algae scrubbers needs. I will dig up the research on it for you.

Alright. I do plan on getting some of that canvas, just dont want to make a 1.5hr trip for a $4 item lol.

[srusso]

Originally Posted by BluScrnOdeth

Alright. I do plan on getting some of that canvas, just dont want to make a 1.5hr trip for a $4 item lol.

Totally understandable... No walmarts near by? You may find something there.

[BluScrnOdeth]

I have been to walmart 3 times looking for anything that could be usable and have come home empty handed. I even asked 3 employees there and of course you know how that goes. They dont now whats in the store or where its at, they just fill shelves and go home. There is also a Lowes and a Menards just down the street, i went there and asked a couple people and they found some things that i could make work, but i think i would end up with the same result (a screen i would end up replacing with this plastic canvas eventually). My wife likes Hobby Lobby and i think Pear1 Imports is close by it so we might just need to make a trip down there to get some things and make a day of it soon.

When i was at Homedepot the other day to get the lights and stuff i didnt even think about asking if they may have something close.... In a rush to get my homework started. Hmmm, Sat we will be about 30min away from there, going to a home convention thing, so I think I'll just swing by there then.

[Swanwillow]

What I used and started out with (and, even though I was told it wouldn't worked, did and does still work rather well) is got a small starboard type cutting board, and roughed it up to high h3ll. When I got a screen, I put it over the top of the board (double layer). Its only one side, but it works for the application I use it for. And boy, can you SEE the stuff growing on it (both the screen and board now)

[srusso]

Originally Posted by SSpiro

Should have taken updated pics, these pics are actually old at this point.

• Light is a CFL. It's just in a floodlight style housing, complete with internal reflector.
• Light has been moved 4-5 inches away already, as I already had experienced algae burning off in the middle closest to the lamp.
• I can not fit a lamp on the backside of the scrubber. Just no room, so i don't have any options here
• Although I had roughed up the screen simply by using very coarse sandpaper, seems to be doing just fine. I'll have my first harvest tonight.

Yeah, after I posted that comment, I gave the light a second look and it seemed like one of those hybrid CFLs in a traditional housing. I have CFLs inside frosted globe bulbs above the mirror in the bathroom.

That being said, I understand it maybe hard to get bulbs in that tight space, but take a look at my pictures in the first few posts of the thread. You would have to switch to standard CFLs but buy some drop lights for $6 dollars each at homedepot. Hang them from the underside of the tank down one above the other. It will actually make more space than you have with just the one clip light!

As for the sand paper thing... It will not work in the long run. You need spurs and spikes coming off the screen which sand paper will not create. I am not saying sand paper will not make a rough surface, just not the jagged spiky surface your looking for... The part that is deceiving is the algae that commonly grows in the beginning of starting an algae scrubber will grow on almost anything. Even glass as we see in our tanks! After the screen has had a chance to mature and begins growing hair and turf it just can't hang on like it needs to, because of the lack of large spurs and spikes.

Even though SantaMonica disagreed with me when I used the term "Velcro" take a look at the rough side of velcro and see all the hooked spurs that when placed together attach to the fabric side with all the sloops. Those hooked spurs are what your trying to create on your screen.

As a test... If I could find a large Velcro sheet that didn't have glue on the back I would try that as a screen. Still looking around.

But in conclusion sand paper is no good.

[SSpiro]

Drop lights are what i have, and/or clip-on lights also.

There is just NO place to mount or secure the light. I've tried every angle, unfortunately. I'll take a look again for fun..

[Floyd R Turbo]

Space seems to be the #1 problem as most people try to cram everything they can into the smallest space possible, then when something like this comes into the mix they just can't fit it in. Do what you can do I guess, if it works and you like it and are comfortable getting rid of the skimmer, you'll have more room to work with.

[slow_leak]

I have run Algae Turf Scrubber since last September.

I researched many texts and sites and saw mixed reviews. What caught my interest were the build threads on Marine Depot from Eric Borneman. He is considered controversial by some. Space in sump is a big deal for some and some wives.

I build a no spray box design that is an add on fed from mag 5. I originally ran it as an add on to directly replace a standard refugium with chateomorpha, and watched very carefully. I found chateomorpha would grow fairly well on its own but had persistent diatom problem from active medium clam and goby. I never had a bad algae problem over all. Tank was prone to red turf algae and cyano already.

Diatoms disappeared in two weeks. First week I was unsure but second week left no doubt. Slime algae in overflows decreased in 6-8 till almost nothing.

This was not a controlled experiment however. Tank is primarily a grow out tank for SPS clonies for a reef display. Fish are secondary and load is medium to light. I lost Scoly LPS during switch over I had for many years, but also aquired scribbled rabbit fish at same time. Acans are not full like they were before. However SPS responded very well to the lower nutrient levels. I have no doubt about this since I have grown them for at least 8 years. I am on second tank as first one lost power while away.

My long term plan is to continue grow out and move over to custom tank stand and sump to tuck everything away at some point. From a practical point of view this system can handle any reasonable feeding schedule. I fed as much as 20cc Oyster feast and 4-8 cubes of thawed and rinsed foods.

These tanks from my experience are prone to cyano much like carbon dosing. I have been able to control it with bacteria, reduce feeding etc. I have run it with and without skimmers and carbon. Skimmer product is very light after several months. Feather dusters and various growth in overflows is a concern but not a real problem.

Here are some pictures of tank and ATS build.

[srusso]

Originally Posted by Floyd R Turbo

Space seems to be the #1 problem as most people try to cram everything they can into the smallest space possible, then when something like this comes into the mix they just can't fit it in. Do what you can do I guess, if it works and you like it and are comfortable getting rid of the skimmer, you'll have more room to work with.

I was going say the same thing about the skimmer but when people get comfortable with equipment it's hard to make changes like that... At least when the tank is doing well and not having issues.

[srusso]

Originally Posted by slow_leak

I have run Algae Turf Scrubber since last September.

I researched many texts and sites and saw mixed reviews. What caught my interest were the build threads on Marine Depot from Eric Borneman. He is considered controversial by some. Space in sump is a big deal for some and some wives.

I build a no spray box design that is an add on fed from mag 5. I originally ran it as an add on to directly replace a standard refugium with chateomorpha, and watched very carefully. I found chateomorpha would grow fairly well on its own but had persistent diatom problem from active medium clam and goby. I never had a bad algae problem over all. Tank was prone to red turf algae and cyano already.

Diatoms disappeared in two weeks. First week I was unsure but second week left no doubt. Slime algae in overflows decreased in 6-8 till almost nothing.

This was not a controlled experiment however. Tank is primarily a grow out tank for SPS clonies for a reef display. Fish are secondary and load is medium to light. I lost Scoly LPS during switch over I had for many years, but also aquired scribbled rabbit fish at same time. Acans are not full like they were before. However SPS responded very well to the lower nutrient levels. I have no doubt about this since I have grown them for at least 8 years. I am on second tank as first one lost power while away.

My long term plan is to continue grow out and move over to custom tank stand and sump to tuck everything away at some point. From a practical point of view this system can handle any reasonable feeding schedule. I fed as much as 20cc Oyster feast and 4-8 cubes of thawed and rinsed foods.

These tanks from my experience are prone to cyano much like carbon dosing. I have been able to control it with bacteria, reduce feeding etc. I have run it with and without skimmers and carbon. Skimmer product is very light after several months. Feather dusters and various growth in overflows is a concern but not a real problem.

Here are some pictures of tank and ATS build.

Nice build!! Thank you sharing!! Any more pictures of the tank? Or the scrubber in use? Perfect build! Nice T5 lights, I assume you have lights one both sides? Nice simple design! A++ better then my setup by far!!

[BluScrnOdeth]

you ever get into those debates with people who are just so set in one way and are unwilling to budge their thoughts to think outside the box.... SO i flipped the switch and am trying to use his negativity into getting some answers that are constructive about breeding clams. Sorry, i know, off topic, just has to share...

[slow_leak]

Nice build!! Thank you sharing!! Any more pictures of the tank? Or the scrubber in use? Perfect build! Nice T5 lights, I assume you have lights one both sides? Nice simple design! A++ better then my setup by far!!

I really need a new camera. Current camera model is not satisfactory for reef tanks. I may borrow work camera sometime soon. Current tank is still grow out. I don't run an SPS chop shop and like grow outs with space. Issue is a little noise right now, but tucks away on right and acts light a house night light.

I am going to make a custom stainless stand with cabinet to tuck ATS on left Sump on right and electronics on right without spreading out everywhere. I am interested in Reef Savy Miami tank over 1-2 years to get together. Light is one side as and now has reflective mylar on other side. It is plenty big for my needs already.

I does 1.8 cc of Seachem Iron Gluconate/Iodide mix right now. I will likely add Calcium Nitrate to keep screen from stalling at about 0.05 ppm daily as a start. I run an old Euroreef CS8-2 (I Think). I really dont like the direction skimmers have gone in recent years with complexity and hard to maintain.

you ever get into those debates with people who are just so set in one way and are unwilling to budge their thoughts to think outside the box.... SO i flipped the switch and am trying to use his negativity into getting some answers that are constructive about breeding clams. Sorry, i know, off topic, just has to share...

ATS are only a tool. I am in fact only run hybrid systems. What makes it hard to accept is other ideas that come along with ATS systems, such as lack of water changes, and lack of carbon etc.

Most people commenting have not run them at all or perhaps incorrectly. I have not lost a single SPS and calcium demand has increase greatly since installing last September. This is anecdotal since many succeed with out it.

There is nothing to sell but hydroponic bulbs I would suspect they will be used rarely overall. Older aquarium books suggest they are not for everyone, however Sprung vol3 suggests there is certainly a place for them if not entirely understood. I would avoid Guru-ism and only show results.

[srusso]

Originally Posted by Swanwillow

What I used and started out with (and, even though I was told it wouldn't worked, did and does still work rather well) is got a small starboard type cutting board, and roughed it up to high h3ll. When I got a screen, I put it over the top of the board (double layer). Its only one side, but it works for the application I use it for. And boy, can you SEE the stuff growing on it (both the screen and board now)

Would you mind posting some pictures of your setup? I would love to see how you used materials you had to create your algae scrubber.

[rysher]

my 1 day old scrubber.
solved the "water not wetting some part of the screen".

scrubber info:
6x9 inch
(2) 23 watts CFL 5000Kelvin
spray box sitting on sump lid
as of this posting, the scrubber is 2hrs old.

[BluScrnOdeth]

Is your screen roughed up? doesnt look like it. Your algae will have a hard time clinging on.