Larval Stenopus hispidus

Luis A M · 04/20/2006, 04:47 PM

This is a new born S.hispidus.First stage larva is called zoea 1 characterized by sessile eyes.See the narrow tail fin,shaped like that of a whale (or a fish)

Luis A M · 04/20/2006, 04:52 PM

Trying again:

Luis A M · 04/20/2006, 04:56 PM

and for a lateral view:

NicoleC · 04/20/2006, 05:05 PM

Nice photos!

FuEl · 04/21/2006, 02:14 AM

Wish I could take photos as good as yours. Obviously I need to take up a course in photography.

Luis A M · 04/21/2006, 12:13 PM

Thanks for your flattering but the pics could still be improved a lot.
DidnÃ‚Â´t put a size reference,but a new born brine shrimp can be seen in the dorsal view.
The greenish material inside is remnant of the egg yolk.

Luis A M · 04/21/2006, 06:35 PM

This is zoea 2 ,six day old.See the stalked eyes.Some hints of red colour show up.The tail fin is more triangular but still a single piece.

FuEl · 04/22/2006, 12:18 AM

Any pics of the last zoeal stage? I have no idea what stage mine are at. Their overall shape looks just like zoea II, just that they are probably much larger.

Luis A M · 04/22/2006, 11:56 AM

No,this is a "live"project.Larvae are still Z2.As long as they survive,I will keep taking pictures of any obvious different stages.
Problem is that I am not aware of any larval description of Stenopus.
But basically you should expect development to follow the same general line of caridean shrimps:stalked eyes,uropods,pereiopods and pleopods.
I was told that last zoea raised in FIT have claws developed in the 3rd pair.

FuEl · 04/22/2006, 12:19 PM

Yes Luis, I have not been able to find any information with regards to the larval description for Stenopus either.

I did'nt notice much changes in larval morphology while rearing them (at least from the naked eye). Only they just increased in size while maintaining that overall shape. Hmm, the final larval length for Stenopus in the paper is rather confusing. "Stenopus hispidus larvae metamorphosed into 1 cm juveniles at a total larval body length of 2cm."

They do appear to be better swimmers and are more active now compared to their first week of life. Have not popped any under the microscope yet. Maybe I'll have a look tomorrow.

Luis A M · 04/24/2006, 11:32 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by FuEl
Hmm, the final larval length for Stenopus in the paper is rather confusing. "Stenopus hispidus larvae metamorphosed into 1 cm juveniles at a total larval body length of 2cm."

Yes,I assumed the PL has some body flexion that reduces the total lenght.
Besides larvae are usually measured from the tip of the rostrum to the rear edge of the uropods.Larvae have long rostrums.

Anyway my larvae reched the zoea 3 stage,at the age of 12 days.They are molting/changing stages every 6 days,which is about twice as slow than Lysmata larvae.Could result in twice as long larval life

Zoea 3 has the primitive one piece tail fin split into large lateral fins called uropods (exopodites) and a central one called telson,shaped like a fish tail.

and focusing at the tail:

FuEl · 04/25/2006, 04:04 AM

Nice documentation Luis. Yes, growth in Stenopus larvae is indeed terribly slow. The last time I started them off on Artemia but all died by 20+ days while being reared in a beaker. Now I started them off on rotifers and am rearing them in a larger vessel of around 4-5 liters. They seem to be doing much better now, capable of eating blended prawns already.

Noof · 04/25/2006, 05:48 PM

Firstly great photos Luis and I am also looking for information on the larval stages of CBS.
I am a few months away from trying to raise them but have seen similar shrimp kicked off the female in the tank.
Will hopefully let you both know if there are any developments from here later in the year. But at the moment it is clownfish breeding!

Luis A M · 04/25/2006, 06:28 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Noof
But at the moment it is clownfish breeding!

A much more rewarding choice!Trying to raise ornamental shrimp larvae is sort of a masochist game

NicoleC · 04/25/2006, 07:02 PM

I'm watching you closely, Luis. I may want to tackle those pistol shrimp one of these days.

Luis A M · 04/25/2006, 11:24 PM

Good move.Never heard somebody tried.May be they are easy,like sexy shrimps

FuEl · 04/26/2006, 03:22 AM

Hi NicoleC. I have tried once to raise Alpheus randalli. Pretty much all died as I fed only bbs. If you do try, start off with rotifers. Will save you time trying again.

Luis, I have found that although blended seafood works for Lysmata larvae it's a little more tricky for Stenopus larvae. Just today I noticed a couple of individuals with their uropods tangled together (due to small prawn bits, etc). Most of the food was gone though, meaning they are actually very big eaters! Still racking my head on improving their diet besides using cyclopeeze.

What did you mean by: "trying to raise ornamental shrimp is a masochist game"?

NicoleC · 04/26/2006, 06:51 AM

Thanks for the suggestion, FuEl. I was thinking about commercial larval shrimp diet, although it's for eating shrimp and not ornamental shrimp.

Luis A M · 05/01/2006, 01:49 PM

This is Z4 at 16 days.The tail fin is now made of 5 pieces,like in adults.
Two external exopodites,quite large.
Two endopodites,transparent, about as long as the telson.
The central telson,now narrower and tinted red.The rear edge is still "fish tail"shaped.
So far I can only see three pairs of legs (called pereiopods)
All pics in this larval series measure 6.5x5mm.
[IMG]//http://reefcentral.com/gallery/data/568/44505S_hispidus_Z_4.JPG [/IMG]

Luis A M · 05/01/2006, 01:52 PM

oops

FuEl · 05/02/2006, 04:48 AM

Nice, looking forward to more pictures.

I never figured out what were exopodites or endopodites. Only terms familiar to me are uropod and telson.

spawner · 05/02/2006, 07:00 AM

Wow Luis, get them an a microscope adaptor for the dig. camera and off he goes

Enjoy zoea 5-6, not much changes until you get to around z9 or so.

redcray · 05/02/2006, 12:17 PM

Nice shots, Luis

And thank you for the papers from the other thread:
http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/sh...hreadid=826515

Googling around the web I came upon an interesting link which I would like to share with you:

http://216.168.47.67/cis-fishnet/JAAS/D044.htm

On the flipside I found also two articles in my mold gathering literature. Ring the bell if you would like the pdfs.

Matt

Luis A M · 05/03/2006, 12:51 PM

Thanks Matt,

This is indeed an interesting paper,though with some pitfalls.They didnÃ‚Â´t monitor the larval development stages and somehow decided that at 35 days the larvae should be ready for their settlement experiments.Rearing/water conditions seem also poor.
This paper sounds familiar but from sometime in my pre-Internet life

.Seems it was written ca.1980?.
PM the titles of those papers,I might have them.

Luis A M · 05/03/2006, 01:05 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by spawner
Wow Luis, get them an a microscope adaptor for the dig. camera and off he goes Enjoy zoea 5-6, not much changes until you get to around z9 or so.

And whom is to blame for telling me about the adaptor in the first place?.

As far as Stenopus larval stages,I never found any published description.So the only thing I can do is to look for significant morphological changes and give them stage numbers.Not very academic

ArenÃ‚Â´t you aware of ANY larval description,even unofficial?.I know the FIT raised them

Nice you chime in (at last)

04/20/2006, 04:47 PM	#1
Luis A M Premium Member Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: Buenos Aires,Argentina Posts: 1,689	Larval Stenopus hispidus This is a new born S.hispidus.First stage larva is called zoea 1 characterized by sessile eyes.See the narrow tail fin,shaped like that of a whale (or a fish) __________________ Luis A M Current Tank Info: I keep about 40 tanks,for breeding and larval raising.Most are 10 gallons.

04/20/2006, 04:52 PM	#2
Luis A M Premium Member Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: Buenos Aires,Argentina Posts: 1,689	Trying again: __________________ Luis A M Current Tank Info: I keep about 40 tanks,for breeding and larval raising.Most are 10 gallons.

04/20/2006, 04:56 PM	#3
Luis A M Premium Member Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: Buenos Aires,Argentina Posts: 1,689	and for a lateral view: __________________ Luis A M Current Tank Info: I keep about 40 tanks,for breeding and larval raising.Most are 10 gallons.

04/20/2006, 05:05 PM	#4
NicoleC Registered Member Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: Madison, AL Posts: 8,875	Nice photos! __________________ Don't count your gobies before they've metamorphasized. Current Tank Info: 40g Indo-Pacific lagoon with tank bred livestock

04/21/2006, 02:14 AM	#5
FuEl Registered Member Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: Malaysia, Singapore, Australia Posts: 237	Wish I could take photos as good as yours. Obviously I need to take up a course in photography. __________________ Bred blood, skunk, peppermint and camel shrimps, sugar gliders, leopard geckos, Phelsuma standingi, Goniurosaurus hainanensis.

04/21/2006, 12:13 PM	#6
Luis A M Premium Member Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: Buenos Aires,Argentina Posts: 1,689	Thanks for your flattering but the pics could still be improved a lot. DidnÃ‚Â´t put a size reference,but a new born brine shrimp can be seen in the dorsal view. The greenish material inside is remnant of the egg yolk. __________________ Luis A M Current Tank Info: I keep about 40 tanks,for breeding and larval raising.Most are 10 gallons.

04/21/2006, 06:35 PM	#7
Luis A M Premium Member Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: Buenos Aires,Argentina Posts: 1,689	This is zoea 2 ,six day old.See the stalked eyes.Some hints of red colour show up.The tail fin is more triangular but still a single piece. __________________ Luis A M Current Tank Info: I keep about 40 tanks,for breeding and larval raising.Most are 10 gallons.

04/22/2006, 12:18 AM	#8
FuEl Registered Member Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: Malaysia, Singapore, Australia Posts: 237	Any pics of the last zoeal stage? I have no idea what stage mine are at. Their overall shape looks just like zoea II, just that they are probably much larger. __________________ Bred blood, skunk, peppermint and camel shrimps, sugar gliders, leopard geckos, Phelsuma standingi, Goniurosaurus hainanensis.

04/22/2006, 11:56 AM	#9
Luis A M Premium Member Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: Buenos Aires,Argentina Posts: 1,689	No,this is a "live"project.Larvae are still Z2.As long as they survive,I will keep taking pictures of any obvious different stages. Problem is that I am not aware of any larval description of Stenopus. But basically you should expect development to follow the same general line of caridean shrimps:stalked eyes,uropods,pereiopods and pleopods. I was told that last zoea raised in FIT have claws developed in the 3rd pair. __________________ Luis A M Current Tank Info: I keep about 40 tanks,for breeding and larval raising.Most are 10 gallons.

04/22/2006, 12:19 PM	#10
FuEl Registered Member Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: Malaysia, Singapore, Australia Posts: 237	Yes Luis, I have not been able to find any information with regards to the larval description for Stenopus either. I did'nt notice much changes in larval morphology while rearing them (at least from the naked eye). Only they just increased in size while maintaining that overall shape. Hmm, the final larval length for Stenopus in the paper is rather confusing. "Stenopus hispidus larvae metamorphosed into 1 cm juveniles at a total larval body length of 2cm." They do appear to be better swimmers and are more active now compared to their first week of life. Have not popped any under the microscope yet. Maybe I'll have a look tomorrow. __________________ Bred blood, skunk, peppermint and camel shrimps, sugar gliders, leopard geckos, Phelsuma standingi, Goniurosaurus hainanensis.

04/25/2006, 04:04 AM	#12
FuEl Registered Member Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: Malaysia, Singapore, Australia Posts: 237	Nice documentation Luis. Yes, growth in Stenopus larvae is indeed terribly slow. The last time I started them off on Artemia but all died by 20+ days while being reared in a beaker. Now I started them off on rotifers and am rearing them in a larger vessel of around 4-5 liters. They seem to be doing much better now, capable of eating blended prawns already. __________________ Bred blood, skunk, peppermint and camel shrimps, sugar gliders, leopard geckos, Phelsuma standingi, Goniurosaurus hainanensis.

04/25/2006, 05:48 PM	#13
Noof Registered Member Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: Adelaide Australia Posts: 74	Firstly great photos Luis and I am also looking for information on the larval stages of CBS. I am a few months away from trying to raise them but have seen similar shrimp kicked off the female in the tank. Will hopefully let you both know if there are any developments from here later in the year. But at the moment it is clownfish breeding!

04/25/2006, 07:02 PM	#15
NicoleC Registered Member Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: Madison, AL Posts: 8,875	I'm watching you closely, Luis. I may want to tackle those pistol shrimp one of these days. __________________ Don't count your gobies before they've metamorphasized. Current Tank Info: 40g Indo-Pacific lagoon with tank bred livestock

04/25/2006, 11:24 PM	#16
Luis A M Premium Member Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: Buenos Aires,Argentina Posts: 1,689	Good move.Never heard somebody tried.May be they are easy,like sexy shrimps __________________ Luis A M Current Tank Info: I keep about 40 tanks,for breeding and larval raising.Most are 10 gallons.

04/26/2006, 03:22 AM	#17
FuEl Registered Member Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: Malaysia, Singapore, Australia Posts: 237	Hi NicoleC. I have tried once to raise Alpheus randalli. Pretty much all died as I fed only bbs. If you do try, start off with rotifers. Will save you time trying again. Luis, I have found that although blended seafood works for Lysmata larvae it's a little more tricky for Stenopus larvae. Just today I noticed a couple of individuals with their uropods tangled together (due to small prawn bits, etc). Most of the food was gone though, meaning they are actually very big eaters! Still racking my head on improving their diet besides using cyclopeeze. What did you mean by: "trying to raise ornamental shrimp is a masochist game"? __________________ Bred blood, skunk, peppermint and camel shrimps, sugar gliders, leopard geckos, Phelsuma standingi, Goniurosaurus hainanensis.

04/26/2006, 06:51 AM	#18
NicoleC Registered Member Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: Madison, AL Posts: 8,875	Thanks for the suggestion, FuEl. I was thinking about commercial larval shrimp diet, although it's for eating shrimp and not ornamental shrimp. __________________ Don't count your gobies before they've metamorphasized. Current Tank Info: 40g Indo-Pacific lagoon with tank bred livestock

05/01/2006, 01:49 PM	#19
Luis A M Premium Member Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: Buenos Aires,Argentina Posts: 1,689	Zoea 4 This is Z4 at 16 days.The tail fin is now made of 5 pieces,like in adults. Two external exopodites,quite large. Two endopodites,transparent, about as long as the telson. The central telson,now narrower and tinted red.The rear edge is still "fish tail"shaped. So far I can only see three pairs of legs (called pereiopods) All pics in this larval series measure 6.5x5mm. [IMG]//http://reefcentral.com/gallery/data/568/44505S_hispidus_Z_4.JPG [/IMG] __________________ Luis A M Current Tank Info: I keep about 40 tanks,for breeding and larval raising.Most are 10 gallons.

05/01/2006, 01:52 PM	#20
Luis A M Premium Member Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: Buenos Aires,Argentina Posts: 1,689	oops __________________ Luis A M Current Tank Info: I keep about 40 tanks,for breeding and larval raising.Most are 10 gallons.

05/02/2006, 04:48 AM	#21
FuEl Registered Member Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: Malaysia, Singapore, Australia Posts: 237	Nice, looking forward to more pictures. I never figured out what were exopodites or endopodites. Only terms familiar to me are uropod and telson. __________________ Bred blood, skunk, peppermint and camel shrimps, sugar gliders, leopard geckos, Phelsuma standingi, Goniurosaurus hainanensis.

05/02/2006, 07:00 AM	#22
spawner Reefer Join Date: Feb 2001 Location: FL EAST COAST Posts: 517	Wow Luis, get them an a microscope adaptor for the dig. camera and off he goes Enjoy zoea 5-6, not much changes until you get to around z9 or so. __________________ Andy "If we knew what it was we were doing, it would not be called research, would it?" Albert Einstein

05/02/2006, 12:17 PM	#23
redcray Registered Member Join Date: Oct 2004 Location: 12°7'4"S, 77°0'56"W Posts: 29	stenopus literature update Nice shots, Luis And thank you for the papers from the other thread: http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/sh...hreadid=826515 Googling around the web I came upon an interesting link which I would like to share with you: http://216.168.47.67/cis-fishnet/JAAS/D044.htm On the flipside I found also two articles in my mold gathering literature. Ring the bell if you would like the pdfs. Matt

05/03/2006, 12:51 PM	#24
Luis A M Premium Member Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: Buenos Aires,Argentina Posts: 1,689	Thanks Matt, This is indeed an interesting paper,though with some pitfalls.They didnÃ‚Â´t monitor the larval development stages and somehow decided that at 35 days the larvae should be ready for their settlement experiments.Rearing/water conditions seem also poor. This paper sounds familiar but from sometime in my pre-Internet life .Seems it was written ca.1980?. PM the titles of those papers,I might have them. __________________ Luis A M Current Tank Info: I keep about 40 tanks,for breeding and larval raising.Most are 10 gallons.